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Eric G.




Location: Arizona
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PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 5:45 pm    Post subject: Help Selecting Chain Mail         Reply with quote

As of today my collection only consists of weapons. I've been considering changing that, and I think that I want to do so by buying a hauberk.

I am very concerned with buying something that I will be happy with for a long time. Can those of you that own chain mail recommend any particular hauberk? I have put some thought into this, and I think I am looking for the following things:

Something aesthetically pleasing
Functional (nothing made of aluminum)
Not too expensive, if possible...
Moderate to high historical accuracy
Easy to take care of

I realize that the last two items on the list might not be completely compatible. I'm hoping for a nice balance between the two, but I'm sure the points presented by those who reply will sway my opinion. Someone recommended ringmesh.com on a thread I saw on SBG, but I just don't know enough about it to fully trust an independent decision.

As always, pictures of your own mail will be very much appreciated!

Thanks in advance for your help!

Eric Gregersen
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William Frisbee




Location: South Shore, MA
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PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 8:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Go to Kult of Athena.

Get the GDFB Chain Mail Hauberk four wedge riveted in one solid flattened ring in Mild Steel for $429.95. Looks good, decently historically accurate, and light.


http://www.kultofathena.com/armor-body.asp
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Thom R.




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PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 9:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would suggest you peruse this thread from spotlight topics

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=19189

and this from the featured articles

http://www.myArmoury.com/feature_mail.html

before doing anything....... tr
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Craig Peters




PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 9:58 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I second what Thom says. If you're going to purchase mail, it's best to educate yourself about it as much as possible first.
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Eric G.




Location: Arizona
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PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 10:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William Frisbee wrote:

Get the GDFB Chain Mail Hauberk four wedge riveted in one solid flattened ring in Mild Steel for $429.95. Looks good, decently historically accurate, and light.


William,

Thank you for the suggestion. Do you have this hauberk? Why do you recommend it? I would really appreciate it if you could tell me a little about the mail. I've seen it many times on KoA and considered it, but why do you like it?

Tom,

Thanks for the articles. I've actually already read the featured article that you posted but I'm excited to really dig into that spotlight thread that you referenced.

Eric Gregersen
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Wed 13 Apr, 2011 11:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Eric Gregersen wrote:
William Frisbee wrote:

Get the GDFB Chain Mail Hauberk four wedge riveted in one solid flattened ring in Mild Steel for $429.95. Looks good, decently historically accurate, and light.


William,

Thank you for the suggestion. Do you have this hauberk? Why do you recommend it? I would really appreciate it if you could tell me a little about the mail. I've seen it many times on KoA and considered it, but why do you like it?

Tom,

Thanks for the articles. I've actually already read the featured article that you posted but I'm excited to really dig into that spotlight thread that you referenced.


Yes, don't jump into getting reproduction maille as most or even all reproduction stuff is fairly ahistorical. For many folks interested in historical accuracy, purchasing maille just doesn't seem worth it. The product of historical maille just doesnt lend itself to modern methods of manufacture.

Pay attention to posts by Dan Howard who seems to be one of the more informed posters here on myArmoury regarding questions of maille.

You could spend much more than $1000 and still get something very far off the authenticity mark.
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Randall Moffett




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PostPosted: Thu 14 Apr, 2011 6:28 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

..... Dan in the thread Thom just posted clearly states it is not his purpose from keeping people from buying the riveted mail readily available, only to be aware of it short comings, especially for testing.

To me, who has handled literally hundreds of bits of authentic mail I'd much rather have people in cheaper riveted mail than butted or none at all. There are a lot of guys who do not even bother as it is so hard to find one that is spot on 100% right, for good reason, there are a plethora of technical and design differences in the manufacture. Some look very good actually.

The mass produced ones do seem to be rather sharp. I have been trying to think of an easy way of fixing this but still no idea besides sandpaper.

RPM
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William Frisbee




Location: South Shore, MA
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PostPosted: Thu 14 Apr, 2011 6:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yes, I own a haubergeon from GDFB, four riveted links in one solid link.





Is it perfect? Nope. But for the price you pay for it you can't get much better. I've not handled Jeff Hedgecock's maille directly so I don't know how it compares to it, but having owned a Forth Amoury Haubergeon in the past, I would say I like the quality of metal in the GDFB armour.

What do I like about it? Its much more comfortable than any other haubergeon I've worn before due to its weight and fit. It isn't as baggy as the other haubergeons I've had before.

The metal is SLIGHTLY blackened, which seems to help resist oxidation, especially considering the fact that at least once a month I am wearing it all day during my WMA school's open sparring day. No rust has formed on it yet. Also the arm attachements and chest areas all feature some very nice fittings for both expansion joints and contraction points, it moves with you very well.

I can EASILY get spare rings for it for a low price.

And it looks good on me. =)
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Eric G.




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PostPosted: Thu 14 Apr, 2011 9:36 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William and all,

Thanks so much for all your help. I really appreciate it. I have heard a few comments about some mail being a little sharp. I'm guessing that the one you recommended has no problems with that?

Now I just have to convince the wife...

Eric Gregersen
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Christian G. Cameron




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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 4:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'd like to thank you guys, too. I've been lurking on this topic... I have read the articles, and I get it.

There are certain items in historical reenacting that we can't seem to get the economics of to reproduce. 18th c. stockings come to mind. 18th c. fuzee drive watches.

And now--chain maille.

But this thread helped clarify the whole thing, and I appreciate it!

Christian G. Cameron

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William Frisbee




Location: South Shore, MA
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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 4:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Eric Gregersen wrote:
William and all,

Thanks so much for all your help. I really appreciate it. I have heard a few comments about some mail being a little sharp. I'm guessing that the one you recommended has no problems with that?

Now I just have to convince the wife...



I cannot say I have had a proble with it being sharp.

However while sparring one day someone did decide to attempt to knee me in the groin. With nothing but hosen covering said person's knee, the mail did act like sandpaper..
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Josh Warren




Location: Manhattan, Kansas
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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 9:25 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I want to toss in another recommendation for the GDFB alternating solid/riveted hauberk, as I just got one a couple weeks ago. It's wonderful. I second everything that Mr. Frisbee has said about it.
Non Concedo
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Thom R.




Location: Tucson
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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 2:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have found that the wedge riveted mail is definitely kinder to arming garments than the dome riveted but it might not be period appropriate for you depending on how early of a depiction you are looking to do.

here is another good thread if you haven't seen it

http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=13424

as it brings up the use of gores for fitting the body and gussets at the elbows and armpits. it can make a huge difference in my experience to have your mail properly fitted.
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Eric G.




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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 9:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William Frisbee wrote:
Eric Gregersen wrote:
William and all,

Thanks so much for all your help. I really appreciate it. I have heard a few comments about some mail being a little sharp. I'm guessing that the one you recommended has no problems with that?

Now I just have to convince the wife...



I cannot say I have had a proble with it being sharp.

However while sparring one day someone did decide to attempt to knee me in the groin. With nothing but hosen covering said person's knee, the mail did act like sandpaper..


HA! Well I hope that whoever tried to knee you got the worst of it... truly.


And Thom R. Thanks for the reference. I'm going to take some time and check it out.

Eric Gregersen
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William Frisbee




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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 11:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Eric Gregersen wrote:


HA! Well I hope that whoever tried to knee you got the worst of it... truly.


And Thom R. Thanks for the reference. I'm going to take some time and check it out.


Eric, yes she did, and she got a nice bruise along her ribs from my fetter...
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Fri 15 Apr, 2011 11:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Eric Gregersen wrote:
William and all,

Thanks so much for all your help. I really appreciate it. I have heard a few comments about some mail being a little sharp. I'm guessing that the one you recommended has no problems with that?

Now I just have to convince the wife...


If maintenance and rust is something you want to minimize or avoid there is the option of GDFB stainless rings:
http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=...7%27+Chest

There is also a smaller size available and the zinc plated maille is a less expensive alternate that resist rust almost as well but does have a slight " chain link fence look " and smell !

Authentic maille is certainly important for some but if the maille looks good at 10 feet it's sort of good for me if it's well made and certainly riveted maille. The problem with " authentic " maille is that it's very expensive if one can find it and it can be a long long wait for it to be custom made.

And as Randall said, Dan's point is to know what you are getting and then decide if it fill your needs and the concessions to authenticity being acceptable at the price you would be paying.

Oh, and Kult of Athena give very good and fast customer service. Wink

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William Frisbee




Location: South Shore, MA
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PostPosted: Sat 16 Apr, 2011 6:56 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jean has a good point.


My last Haubergeon was the stainless one he posted. I wasn't happy with the extra weight (27 or so lbs vs about 17 for my current one), and the "shiny" was kind of much which is why I made the move to the new, lighter piece.

I just ordered some spare rings and rivets from Kult along with the tool needed to set the rivet. That will allow me to do repairs and some better fitting of the sleeves.

I get all my stuff that isn't custom made from Kult due to the customer service and fast shipping.
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Ian S LaSpina




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PostPosted: Mon 18 Apr, 2011 6:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William Frisbee wrote:
Jean has a good point.


My last Haubergeon was the stainless one he posted. I wasn't happy with the extra weight (27 or so lbs vs about 17 for my current one), and the "shiny" was kind of much which is why I made the move to the new, lighter piece.

I just ordered some spare rings and rivets from Kult along with the tool needed to set the rivet. That will allow me to do repairs and some better fitting of the sleeves.

I get all my stuff that isn't custom made from Kult due to the customer service and fast shipping.


I own a stainless haubergeon from icefalcon. It looks good, was reasonably priced, but it's pretty heavy and definitely wears on you when it's on for long periods of time. Question about the mild GDFB stuff though, did it come covered in shipping grease? And if so, how did you clean it off without rusting it? I cleaned my stainless with a solution of water and simple green, but would be very hesitant to do that with mild steel. Honestly though, the weight of my stainless often makes me not want to wear it.

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Sean Manning




Location: Austria
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PostPosted: Tue 19 Apr, 2011 7:59 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Word to the wise: Get lots of measurements, a weight, and whether the armour is galvanized. Some modern mail is oversized and very heavy. Galvanizing often makes the weight worse, but it makes cleaning trivial. Indian suppliers sometimes change their production methods, and distributors sometimes change suppliers, so not all mail from distributor X is the same.
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William Frisbee




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PostPosted: Tue 19 Apr, 2011 8:41 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ian S LaSpina wrote:

I own a stainless haubergeon from icefalcon. It looks good, was reasonably priced, but it's pretty heavy and definitely wears on you when it's on for long periods of time. Question about the mild GDFB stuff though, did it come covered in shipping grease? And if so, how did you clean it off without rusting it? I cleaned my stainless with a solution of water and simple green, but would be very hesitant to do that with mild steel. Honestly though, the weight of my stainless often makes me not want to wear it.


Nah, it was covered in what smelled like WD40. I put it in an old pillow case with some shop towels that absorb all that crap and rolled it around for a couple of hours.

Got all the gunk off of it.


Trust me, after wearing the stainless haubergeon for a season, moving to this more "authentic" looking and weight haubergon was a shoulder saver.
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