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John Apsega




PostPosted: Tue 13 Jul, 2010 10:51 pm    Post subject: Hanwei vs. Valiant Armory         Reply with quote

Hey everybody i have a little issue that I was wondering if you could help me out with.

So im looking at two swords for my first REAL sword to buy they are the Tinker Peirce (Hanwei) Longsword or the Valiant Armory Practical Longsword i have heard good things about both brands and specific swords but I am unsure of what would best suite my needs. I am new to the world of Western Martial arts (I have been studying for about six months now) and i really wish to continue my studies far more seriously. I need a sword that can handle plenty of cutting and abuse on many different things from water bottles to tatami. I have purchased swords before that have been cheap stainless steel wall hangers with out knowing any better and they have preformed OK sometimes but I need something that I can actually cut and train with that I can expect to preform like a real sword should. So if anyone has experience with either of these two swords I would be very happy if you would give me any advice on choosing the right one for what I need.

Thanks
-John-
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Wed 14 Jul, 2010 12:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I own both, and love both. They are both apt cutters, and they both could use a little refinining of the edge out of the box, although they will cut just fine on light targets as is. I lean more toward the H/T due to the handle being longer for my large hands and the more acute blade profile with flared shoulders. Also, the pommel of the H/T is very comfortable fits well in the hand when working though cutting drills. On the downside - the H/T grip has no texture or risers and the handle profile is rectangular; which some people do not find comfortable (I don't mind because it forces proper edge alignment). The H/T is more along the lines of what I think of when I think longsword.

The Valiant offering is a bit faster in the hand because it weighs less. It is well-balanced and a really fast cutter, but lacks what I would consider a good thrusting point. The blade is not as substantial as the H/T, which may be good for some people and bad for others - I feel it hits with less authority. The quality of the grip leather is better for gripping, due to it's texture and risers (something that the H/T lacks). Of course, it has a wheel pommel; which is not overly large so it can be gripped while grasping, but it's not quite as comfortable as the H/T to me.

Both are really great quality for the money; I've not had problems with either. It will really depend on how either feels in your hand for you to get a better idea! I hope I helped you a little bit.

Good luck with your decision! Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Brogdon Combs




Location: Tallahassee, Florida, USA
Joined: 22 Jan 2009

Posts: 52

PostPosted: Wed 14 Jul, 2010 3:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think what Jonathan said sums it up nicely, although there's one other thing I think is worth mentioning.

VA swords come SUPER sharp these days, and while they could be sharper still, it's perfectly functional for cutting all normal targets.

H/T swords, however, come with a kinda-sharp edge, which can cut if your edge allignment is very good, but isn't nearly the brilliantly sharp edge that the VA has.


Personally, though, I just see these as two VERy different swords that are meant for different purposes. I think a fairer comparison would be the H/T bastard sword to the VA 304S Longsword... the VA really is more of a long bastard anyway, IMO.


I hope this helps!

Thanks for the excellent explanation, Jon.

-Brogdon

"Here's to you, mister pirate-ship-captain! With your endless booty calls and a violent streak that makes Grand Theft Auto look like Super Mario Kart, only you could bring the wooden leg back into fashion, and only you could fight three men at a time with a patch over one eye and a hook for a hand."
-Strongblade.com
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John Apsega




PostPosted: Wed 14 Jul, 2010 6:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Which one is more historically accurate?
"With 2000 years of examples behind us we have no excuse when fighting, for not fighting well." T. E. Lawrence
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Wed 14 Jul, 2010 7:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well, neither are too historically accurate. I think the H/T blade could be compared more comfortablyto a Type XVIIIa than when comparing the VA offering to a Type XII - meaning I believe the H/T blade form is closer to being on par. For longsword students, I recommend the H/T. For people who wish to do practical target cutting, I suggest the VA. I just believe that the H/T is more in tune with what a Italian/German longsword student is looking for because of the intended historical design, period, form, and function.

Of course, the hex nut construction throws either of them out the window if you are looking for accuracy. In that vein, I'd have to suggest going with a substantially higher-priced offering. Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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John Apsega




PostPosted: Fri 16 Jul, 2010 2:09 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks you have been a lot of help. If you could advise one sword that would be perfect for practical test cutting and as a good first sword what would you say.
"With 2000 years of examples behind us we have no excuse when fighting, for not fighting well." T. E. Lawrence
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Fri 16 Jul, 2010 4:52 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would say the VA would be better for a first sword. The H/T is heavier and little less forgiving with edge alingnment and could be challenging for a newer swordsman to cut with.
J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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John Apsega




PostPosted: Sat 17 Jul, 2010 4:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks. Im still not entirely sure. I just cant seam to justify spending that much money on my first real sword but i don't know im still tossing around other ideas.
"With 2000 years of examples behind us we have no excuse when fighting, for not fighting well." T. E. Lawrence
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Sat 17 Jul, 2010 7:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well, you are about at the bottom of the price range there on two great swords.$190 is just about as low as you can go and find a decent sword that is still be functional:

http://www.wiwingtiswordsupply.com/SH2394.html

The only thing I can really find cheaper that I might consider buying is here on the MRL Deal of the Day for $132.50:

http://www.museumreplicas.com/p-217-erbach-sword.aspx

Sean Flynt has done some amazing work with these as project pieces here lately. It makes me want to try may hand at doing one up. The blade is solid, but to make it historically accurate takes a little reworking. But, to be honest, even with such a deal on the Erbach, I'd still just spend $60 more on the Tink for my first sword. Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Sean O Stevens




Location: Grovetown, GA
Joined: 22 Oct 2008

Posts: 208

PostPosted: Sun 18 Jul, 2010 11:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I agree... at that price the VA and H/T are the best options... going less expensive you will loss a lot in quality.

I also agree that the H/T is better for tradditional Long Sword study... and the VA is a better cuter 'out of the box'. I myself prefer the H/T because of the longer grip and the more attractive blade shape... but you have to be ready to sharpen it because they almost always come too dull... and the grip leather and fittings are very plain, and I HATE the fiberglass scabbards the Hanwei swords come in. The VA will have a better grip and fittings and a MUCH better scabbard and will come out of the box sharp and ready to cut... but the 7 inch grip is a bit short for me and the blade shape not nearly as attractive as the H/T. Also, the VA is not much of a thruster, while the H/T is.

They are two very different swords that are both great values for the money.
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P. Cha




PostPosted: Sun 18 Jul, 2010 4:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well...I kinda dont like giving swords that cut well to new cutters unless all they are ever gonna care about is backyard cutting. You can develope some pretty bad habits when you get serious that way. At least with less forgiving swords, you'll bat stuff away unless your somewhat doing things right. I have a girl I am training right now and she keeps complaining that my XVa sword is bad for cutting...I keep reminding her that she isn't doing it right and it's not the sword's fault.
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John Apsega




PostPosted: Tue 20 Jul, 2010 2:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I understand what all of you guys are saying actually today i ended up spending 109& for the henry V sword by Hanwei at Kult of Athena. I guess i got a little impatient lol. But now that i read what P. Cha said i totally agree this might work out well for me and help to teach me edge alignment.
"With 2000 years of examples behind us we have no excuse when fighting, for not fighting well." T. E. Lawrence
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P. Cha




PostPosted: Tue 20 Jul, 2010 11:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

John Apsega wrote:
I understand what all of you guys are saying actually today i ended up spending 109& for the henry V sword by Hanwei at Kult of Athena. I guess i got a little impatient lol. But now that i read what P. Cha said i totally agree this might work out well for me and help to teach me edge alignment.


Well badly balanced and weighted swords can develop bad habits too Wink .
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John Apsega




PostPosted: Thu 29 Jul, 2010 12:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Actually P. Cha it is fairly well balances at only about an inch from the guard and weights about 2 1/2 3 pounds. It is very light and quick. My only complaint with it is edge but this is easily fixed with some time. Read my review here http://sbgswordforum.proboards.com/index.cgi?...e=1#291799 at the SBG Sword Forum.

The best to all
-John-

"With 2000 years of examples behind us we have no excuse when fighting, for not fighting well." T. E. Lawrence
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