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Nathan Quarantillo




Location: Eastern Panhandle WV, USA
Joined: 14 Aug 2009

Posts: 279

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 8:40 am    Post subject: Windlass brig.         Reply with quote

Hi all. Does anyone have any experience with the windlass brig? I was planning on ordering a steelmastery, But ive heard that they are somewhat..... questionable........ and the last thing i can afford on my tiny budget is about $200 of my money swiped. So, the windlass is the current candidate. anything on it?

or, If anyone knows any other $200 dollar range decent brigs out there.....chime in please.

"Id rather be historically accurate than politically correct"
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Pauli Vennervirta





Joined: 12 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 9:13 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

You mean like this one? http://rautaportti.fi/Aseet/Haarniskat%20ja%2...adine3.jpg

If you did I have it. My opinion is that it should be customized by the buyer. The straps are weak and break, so they should be replaced and riveted better in place. The whole thing should have more padding between the person using it and the steel plates. For this I made a kind of apron of cell foam. Also the shoulders should be padded.
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Michael B.
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Location: Chugiak, AK
Joined: 18 Oct 2007

Posts: 354

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 11:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

We have one in the group. As Pauli said, you'd probably want to replace the straps, and buckles, and add some padding in the shoulder. We also removed the bottom fringe from it because it looks goofy. It's heavy, but it it works, when worn over a thicker gambeson it's decent protection. Partner that with some some knees, elbows and Wisby gauntlets from Mercenary's Tailor and you'll be rocking!
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Michael Bergstrom
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JG Elmslie
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Location: Scotland
Joined: 18 Jun 2009
Reading list: 28 books

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PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 1:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

200 dollars?
do you have or can borrow a drill, a file, a small ball-pein hammer and a pair of metal shears?

Because that budget (if fabric costs are similar in the US) should buy you 2.5 metres of half-decent cotton velvet for what, 10-15, the same of good tough canvas (cotton, not linen, but, beggars cant be choosers, and if your group will find fault in the use of cotton over linen, they're really going to have a field day with the faults in the windlass/MT one...) for 10, buying 2-3 good 3.5mm drill bits will cost you a fiver, perhaps invest in a centre punch for the drilling if you dont want to use a nail, and the big cost is a sheet of 18ga cold-rolled mild steel for perhaps $80, that whole lump will then leave you with enough cash to decide if you want to go for steel clout nails, or bronze ones, buy a thousand of them, and will still leave you with change for needle and thread...

then you can go searching Mercia Sveiter, or Armoury Mareyk's webpages, and get half a dozen good buckles for 10-15, A strip of decent vegetan leather from a leather supplier for straps, and you're sorted....

net result is you have all the equipment you'll need to make something like this...


http://www.companie-of-st-george.ch/images/pi...tated.jpeg

http://www.companie-of-st-george.ch/images/pi...tated.jpeg

http://www.companie-of-st-george.ch/images/pi...tated.jpeg


which, I hope you'll agree, is'nt so much "a bit higher quality" as is on an entirely different planet of accuracy.

it'll take you a while to do - and I'd strongly reccommend finding if the metal stockist has a powered shear and having him cut some of the steel into strips 2 inches wide, which you can then slice the plates from (saves a LOT of effort for little cost) but the result is worth it.

(I say, looking at the brig propped in the corner that I really need to get round to finishing... like the other bevor, the mail standard with its lining to do, that other bevor to make, etc, etc... Happy )


Last edited by JG Elmslie on Wed 07 Apr, 2010 1:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Zac Evans




Location: London
Joined: 26 Dec 2006

Posts: 151

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 1:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Apologies to anyone who has it, but I wouldn't want the windlass "brig" if it were half that price. Brigandines should have shape and look a whole bunch different to that. Even a coat of plates looks different, and you could make a much nicer one of those for less money than the windlass one costs.
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Michael B.
Industry Professional



Location: Chugiak, AK
Joined: 18 Oct 2007

Posts: 354

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 3:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I agree Zac, someone bought it in the group, decided it wasn't good. Now we have it in the "new students can wear this till they get better gear" pile.
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Michael Bergstrom
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JG Elmslie
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Location: Scotland
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 6:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael B. wrote:
I agree Zac, someone bought it in the group, decided it wasn't good. Now we have it in the "new students can wear this till they get better gear" pile.


I keep saying that the group I'm with should have a couple of comb morions for loaner kit for the same reason. they're so ghastly, they should inspire each member to get nice burgeonets rapidly...

but the main tutor for the group appears to object to the very use of the M-word.... yet alone having them around the place

Happy
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Bill Grandy
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 7:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Zac Evans wrote:
Apologies to anyone who has it, but I wouldn't want the windlass "brig" if it were half that price. Brigandines should have shape and look a whole bunch different to that. Even a coat of plates looks different, and you could make a much nicer one of those for less money than the windlass one costs.


I'm going to have to agree with Zac. It is fine for fantasy costume, but it is most certainly not a historically based brigandine. In fact, I would call it a coat of plates, not a brigandine. It also is also not really good for armour outside of costume. A good padded gambeson alone is probably better protection, as this has very thin plates wrapped in very cheap leather that looks like it will rip apart from light use against blunted weapons (even non-metal ones).

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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 7:50 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bill Grandy wrote:
Zac Evans wrote:
Apologies to anyone who has it, but I wouldn't want the windlass "brig" if it were half that price. Brigandines should have shape and look a whole bunch different to that. Even a coat of plates looks different, and you could make a much nicer one of those for less money than the windlass one costs.


I'm going to have to agree with Zac. It is fine for fantasy costume, but it is most certainly not a historically based brigandine. In fact, I would call it a coat of plates, not a brigandine. It also is also not really good for armour outside of costume. A good padded gambeson alone is probably better protection, as this has very thin plates wrapped in very cheap leather that looks like it will rip apart from light use against blunted weapons (even non-metal ones).


Yeah I like mine as a light coat of plates and it looking generally like a brigantine at 10 feet or maybe 30 feet ..... LOL.

As armour I think it would still work but it does have weaknesses like some gaps between some of the rows of plate and the leather isn't very thick. The straps are flimsy but could be replaced easily and I think the lining will wear out quickly if used often.

I don't find it heavy at all and it will do until or if I eventually get a real brigantine or coat of plates.

Certainly not historically authentic but it looked good with my kit.



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Pauli Vennervirta





Joined: 12 Mar 2009
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Posts: 61

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 10:07 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

[quote="Bill Grandy"]
Zac Evans wrote:


I'm going to have to agree with Zac. It is fine for fantasy costume, but it is most certainly not a historically based brigandine. In fact, I would call it a coat of plates, not a brigandine. It also is also not really good for armour outside of costume. A good padded gambeson alone is probably better protection, as this has very thin plates wrapped in very cheap leather that looks like it will rip apart from light use against blunted weapons (even non-metal ones).


Well, it is not that bad. A friend of mine did those customizations (padded it, made better straps) and it seems to work fine now. It is not as hot to wear as a gambeson and he has sparred with it using steel weapons, the brig has held up just fine. With better straps it also fits more snugly, because you can make it overlap at the sides.

I agree there are much better brigs and other protective equipment, but it is cheap and can be customized.
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David Teague




Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Joined: 25 Jan 2004

Posts: 409

PostPosted: Wed 07 Apr, 2010 11:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Or you can man up and make your own!



Instructions, photos and a pattern http://www.eskimo.com/~cwn/brig_craig1.html

You might be able to get someone like " Rough from the Hammer" to cut out the plates and shape the demi lung plates.

If all you are doing is the riveting, you could build one in a few weeks of steady part time work and blow your friends away with the finished project. Happy There are simpler rivet patterns than the "classic" 3 rivets pattern.

There are lots of places on line to buy the linen canvas cheap, period buckles, and rivets.

Cut the metal out yourself and it's cheap to make, but you make it up in sweat equity with a project like this taking between 100 to 200 hours (depending on how carried away you get with the construction: paint vs tinning, mild steel vs spring steel that has to be tempered, 2 piece rivets vs real rivets, et al)

There are other designs out on the net, Armour Archive has two I think.

I'm thinking that this summer will be my turn to "man up" myself and make me one. Wink

Cheers,

David

This you shall know, that all things have length and measure.

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