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Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > what kind of weapons did the muslims use in the crusades? Reply to topic
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Felix Dale




Location: wales (only studying here)
Joined: 16 Sep 2009

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jan, 2010 10:37 am    Post subject: what kind of weapons did the muslims use in the crusades?         Reply with quote

what it says on the tin.
I am specially interested in swords, as most believe they used scimitars but I seem to recall that scimitars were a later invention.

Thats what being a gentleman is all about!
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Tibor Szebenyi




Location: Hungary
Joined: 26 Jun 2007
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Posts: 45

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jan, 2010 11:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

In which crusade?Happy
During the first crusade they used straight swords just like thier European enemies. Look for mamluk swords on google for example (but not the US Marine Mamluk sword...)
The curved blades came later as You wrote, some say that the Turks brougth it to this area. The Mamluk state confrontated with the Mongols, Persians, Ottomans, and later some French guys. So during the many crusades a crusader was able to get injured from a shamshir, a kilic, a seif, or anything You like. (theese words mean the same, sabre)


Check out this site:
http://users.stlcc.edu/mfuller/turk/TopkapiArms2.html

or my favourite site:
http://museum.velizariy.kiev.ua/turkey/istambul_ma2/index.html

You can see the tables showing the centuries.
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Hisham Gaballa





Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Reading list: 7 books

Posts: 508

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jan, 2010 12:50 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Up until the late 13th century most "Saracen" swords were straight and double-edged. There are quite a few extant early Muslim swords in the Askeri Museum in Istanbul and they also turn up on auction sites now and again.

There have been similar topics in the past with some useful links:
http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=12417
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Felix Dale




Location: wales (only studying here)
Joined: 16 Sep 2009

Posts: 23

PostPosted: Wed 06 Jan, 2010 2:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

oh how silly of me, the third crusade please ;P

thanks I'll look at these links Big Grin

Thats what being a gentleman is all about!
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Hisham Gaballa





Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Reading list: 7 books

Posts: 508

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jan, 2010 2:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have just remembered that Muslim swords from about this period occasionally do come up for auction on Hermann Historica, a pinch of salt is necessary as the provenance of some items is hard to confirm.

Have a look at these:
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm49...at49_A.txt
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm56...at56_p.txt
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Artis Aboltins




PostPosted: Thu 07 Jan, 2010 3:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hisham Gaballa wrote:
I have just remembered that Muslim swords from about this period occasionally do come up for auction on Hermann Historica, a pinch of salt is necessary as the provenance of some items is hard to confirm.

Have a look at these:
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm49...at49_A.txt
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm56...at56_p.txt


Interesting that the secoond one is a "ring sword" of sorts. I assume the ring would have been intended for some sort of thong or chain that would prevent the weapon from beeing lost if accidentally dropped?
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Hisham Gaballa





Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Reading list: 7 books

Posts: 508

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jan, 2010 4:09 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Artis Aboltins wrote:
Interesting that the second one is a "ring sword" of sorts. I assume the ring would have been intended for some sort of thong or chain that would prevent the weapon from beeing lost if accidentally dropped?


I would imagine so. Earlier Islamic sword hilts found by archaeology sometimes have rings also, and later Mamluk, Ottoman and Persian swords from the 15th century onwards often make provision for a lanyard, usually by a hole drilled through the pommel.
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm51...at51_p.txt
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm56...at56_p.txt
http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm49...at49_A.txt
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