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JŠnos Sibinger




Location: Hungary/France
Joined: 31 May 2009

Posts: 50

PostPosted: Sun 03 Jan, 2010 1:09 am    Post subject: Painted helmets and rectangular shoulderguards...         Reply with quote

Greetings, everyone!
Meanwhile I was doing my researche for my greathelm, I came across some pictures of oddly coloured helmets, and painted rectangular shoulder guards (I don't know the correct term for this piece of armour.) How common were these pieces?
Why did they use them? Only a decorative surface for heraldy, or it protected the neck? (On most pictures it overlaps the shoulder. It protected the relatively fragile spine from the attacks of two handed axes? Have a horseman face such attacks?)
Heat treatment might cause changing in colour, but as far as I know, the later bascinets were the first pieces to be hardened like this.
And if these patterns, colours etc. were painted, what kind of paint did they use? I've tried egg based paint, but I don't think so, that it could be applied on metallic surfaces. My only guess is oil paint. This kind of paint is originated from Afghanistan, and was really popular in the renaissance, altough the Benedictine monk, Theophilius Presbyter describes oil painting in his book, the ,,Schedula diversarum artium" (List of various arts, ca.1125.)
I haven't seen any surviving examples of painted helmets or oder pieces of armour, but if any of You did, please be so kind to send a pic. about it!

Thank you for your help,
John



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StChronOutre1350.jpg
Rectangular shoulder guard, with painting on it.
Circa 1330.


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waleweinleidenLtk195f120.jpg
A nother painted shoulder piece,
Circa 1320.


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luttrell.jpg
A fairly known picture. The pattern on the flag, outfit and shoulderguard is the same. Notice the vivid colour on the inside. The whole pice might have been paintod to prevent rusting?
Circa 1330.


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HistConqJeru1337.jpg
Helmets of all colour! Might this be due to the fantasy of the artist?
From between 1295 to 1330.


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BR9245f450v.jpg
A nother example of flat-looking and painted pieces.
From between 1295-1330.


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KAXX.jpg
Note the matching of heraldic symbols.
Circa 1320.

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M. Eversberg II




Location: California, Maryland, USA
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jan, 2010 3:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I believe the word is Epaulette. They're made of leather and painted with milk paint to identify who you are.

M.

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Artis Aboltins




PostPosted: Sun 03 Jan, 2010 4:42 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Those are called ailettes most commonly, as for their actual usage, there are several opinions regarding their usage - some believe that it was used only as bearer of heraldic devices, others - that it offered aditional protection to the neck and shoulder area. From my experiences I can say that they certainly give aditional protection to the area when using steel blunts, as for their effectiveness when using a sharp weapon I can not say, but it would probably not been very high, since they seem to have ben made of wood and covered with parchment.
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M. Eversberg II




Location: California, Maryland, USA
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jan, 2010 2:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Artis would be the winner there, could not for the life of me remember the word ailettes earlier.

M.

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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Sun 03 Jan, 2010 2:44 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is a thread on ailettes.

As for coloured great helms go, they exist in period art. The Maciejowski Bible shows them in white, gray, gold, green, blue, and orange.

See here: http://www.medievaltymes.com/courtyard/images...&d.gif

There is also the famous great helm (the one I use for my avatar) that is painted. it is black with applied gold paint of some sort. There is debate about when that paint was done, though.

The black sallets of the 15th century were commonly painted.

Happy

ChadA

http://chadarnow.com/
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Alex Hoogstraten




Location: The netherlands
Joined: 05 Jan 2010

Posts: 20

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jan, 2010 1:59 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What about painted Bascinets from around 1360-1370.

I'm thinking of painting my Bascinet. In Osprey illustrations this is done. But are there any historical illustrations that show painted bascinets?
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JŠnos Sibinger




Location: Hungary/France
Joined: 31 May 2009

Posts: 50

PostPosted: Sun 10 Jan, 2010 10:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gentlemen, thank you for your quick replies!
Ailettes. I'll bare it in my mind, I was thinking about this quite lot. About their function, material... But I would have never guessed that they were made of organic material. This explains the absence of period remains. (If I said someting really stupid, please let me know!)
I've met with the pictures from the Maciejowsky Bible, and indeed, there are some helmets wich seems to be painted in a really interesting way.
That sallet... My heart started to beat faster! I saw it before, but I just realized, that incredible painting, altough I can't help thinking about the helmet's strange shape. (I have to admit, I really don't know mouch about sallets, but most examples I saw before have got a flat bottom, not a curved one like this. Such helmets were used for martial purposes too? I was really... It was amaizing, but I can't hep thinking about this!)
There is a reply on the forum about painted bascinets:
http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t...p;start=22

Tank you,
John
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