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Luke Zechman




Location: Lock Haven Pennsylvania
Joined: 18 Jan 2009

Posts: 278

PostPosted: Mon 28 Dec, 2009 10:55 am    Post subject: Archtypal Drawing Series         Reply with quote

For a while now I have been playing with the idea of doing a series of drawings. These drawing would include a individual (and his equipment) from a distinct warrior class in a specific region, time and culture. I have heard in the past that Osprey books contain such drawings , but lack to some degree in historical accuracy. I would like these drawing to have a high degree of historical fidelity, in both the equipment used, and how it was adorned. I am starting this thread in order to have this community help me brainstorm on specific topics to include in this series. In other words... what would YOU like to see done. Keep in mind that I want this to be specific, so "Roman Soldier" would not be a good request. Late Roman Infantry Soldier" would be a more acceptable request. So... what would you like to see? Name a few if you like, and be specific. Once I get a good list I will begin my research (with the help of the community), to discover what that particular warrior would have used. Keep in mind that the individual in any of these drawings could be considered an "archetype" for the entire warrior class. Hopefully when these drawings are done they will be a nice learning tool or reference for anyone looking to put together a kit from a similar interest area.
In addition to each drawing I will include a paper that talks about the equipment, and how it was used and constructed. Each of these will be posted here for anyone to view, and naturally I will be looking for criticism. hopefully I will have done proper research and the finished product will be largely accepted as historically accurate.
Thanks in advance for your ideas.

Luke
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Maurizio D'Angelo




Location: Italy
Joined: 09 Feb 2009
Likes: 3 pages
Reading list: 3 books

Posts: 649

PostPosted: Mon 28 Dec, 2009 11:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think your idea is good.
Personally, I studied a lot about the Middle Byzantine period. I think that civilization has often been overlooked. Constantinople, from its founding until his violent looting by the Crusaders, has allowed the development of commercial, political and cultural future. New Rome, resisting the onslaught of many attackers has protected throughout the West since the invasion of new peoples. The Byzantine Empire flourished in the same period while Western Europe was being tried by poverty and violence. However, contrary to its rich heritage and its significant role, the fruits of civilization "Byzantine" are briefly described and often disparaged. The name of Empire, "Byzantine" is, in fact, an insult.
The names with which they are defining things are important in shaping our interpretation of reality.
I'd like to fill these gaps.
The Oriental sources, for several reasons, are often inaccessible to most Europeans, possibly more inaccessible than the European sources are to the students from the Oriental countries. Therefore to establish a kind of team work between students from the Occidental and the Oriental world, out of the desire to supplement the knowledge about the reciprocal actions, caused by weapons and their relations to human civilization in its many branches and fields.
That is my hope, perhaps here is this possible?
Surely some phrase is translated wrong, but the important thing is the concept. Razz
Ciao
Maurizio
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Luke Zechman




Location: Lock Haven Pennsylvania
Joined: 18 Jan 2009

Posts: 278

PostPosted: Mon 28 Dec, 2009 12:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Maurizio,
Thank you for your response, and I was not expecting something so well thought out. So you would like to see something from the "Byzantine" that involves a collaboration of the European and Asian influences of the time? This is a great start, but we will have to narrow down the actual subject of the drawing. I am not very versed in the history of the "Byzantine" Empire, but I am sure it contained a vast array of classes and cultures, as many empires had. I think this is a great idea because the Byzantine Empire is kind of a mystery to me, and will give me a reason to look into it.

Due to the nature of this drawing series, we will have to narrow down our interest in the Byzantine Empire to a more specific time and type of soldier / class. What are your thoughts? After doing a quick search online I have discovered that the Byzantine Empire had persisted for around 1100 years. This is a vast amount of time historically. Where there any specific orders or warrior classes within this Empire that interested you specifically?
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Andrew Maxwell




Location: New Zealand
Joined: 03 May 2009

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Mon 28 Dec, 2009 1:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luke Zechman wrote:
Due to the nature of this drawing series, we will have to narrow down our interest in the Byzantine Empire to a more specific time and type of soldier / class. What are your thoughts? After doing a quick search online I have discovered that the Byzantine Empire had persisted for around 1100 years. This is a vast amount of time historically. Where there any specific orders or warrior classes within this Empire that interested you specifically?


Actually I'd quite like to see that, too- primarily the clibinarii/kataphraktoi from around the time of Belisarius/Justinian (mid 6th C) and also the troops in use at Manzikert (late 11th C).
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Maurizio D'Angelo




Location: Italy
Joined: 09 Feb 2009
Likes: 3 pages
Reading list: 3 books

Posts: 649

PostPosted: Mon 28 Dec, 2009 4:04 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

According to my little knowledge, we have little to be used in the 6th century. Although I like that. We have much, but from the 10th century onwards. A heavily armed foot soldier and a knight, I'd like to see on a drawing.
I have all the Osprey books that speak of Byzantine arms.
I leave behind these books.

Some reliable sources:
Consejo Superior de Investigaciones Científicas - Madrid

Sebastian Cirac Estopanan
Skyllitzes Matritensis, y Reproducciones Miniaturas, Barcelona-Madrid, 1965 by

Ada Brun Hoffmeier
Gladus V - Gladius I

David Nicolle
Constantinople (?)

Maria G. Parani
Reconstructing the Reality of Images: Byzantine Material Culture and ...

Kolias
Bizantinische Waffen

There are some iconography that are considered exempt from artistic license.
For the choice they must be:
comparable with other
the religious aspect should not dominate
exact proportions of the design
in agreement with the texts of books

Many Serbian sources have valuable material, but have a closed circuit, you can not access.
The work will be hard.
Published after some iconography, explaining why can be trusted, according to the texts cited.
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Luke Zechman




Location: Lock Haven Pennsylvania
Joined: 18 Jan 2009

Posts: 278

PostPosted: Tue 29 Dec, 2009 12:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Maurizio,
Since you seem to be interested in seeing this, I will make this the first one in the series. Still need to do a lot of research though. As I mentioned earlier I know very little about the Byzantine empire. This process might take a while since i will do all the research for the drawing before I ever put a pencil to paper, then it will be a little while until the drawing itself is done. If you come across any original prints, modern reenactment kit photos, or other modern artist work would you please send them my way. In the mean time I will be looking through those sources you had sent, and looking over the web. I like the idea of a middle Byzantine heavily armed foot soldier, so I think that is where I will start. Ciao!!

Luke
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Maurizio D'Angelo




Location: Italy
Joined: 09 Feb 2009
Likes: 3 pages
Reading list: 3 books

Posts: 649

PostPosted: Tue 29 Dec, 2009 3:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Luke,
add here, all the resources, I think it not appropriate for a forum, so please contact me in PM with your e-mail.
I send everything I have. Some pages of my books may take a photograph.
Some groups in Australia, very active on this.
In my country, also very active, you know among the Lombards, Byzantines, Normans, Saracens, Spanish, Bourbons, French, Germans, ecc. we did not miss anything ever made. Eek! Laughing Out Loud Razz

The combination of the single details of armament, the types and shapes of arms, their decoration and material tell something about local populations, foreign influence, invasions, folks' movements, warlike conquests etc.
Well, this never was more true than for weapons Byzantine.
Not a sword as possible, but at least 7. Only a few more typical.
Not a single harness horses, just some more typical, etc..
Your design must be typical Byzantine, can not be the sole reference.
Make a drawing of a typical Byzantine infantryman, from these resources is possible.
Add the bibliography, so your work is reliable.
I can not wait to see some drawing.
Ciao
Maurizio
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