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N. Prauda




Location: Finland
Joined: 10 Jan 2008

Posts: 14

PostPosted: Sun 08 Mar, 2009 2:19 pm    Post subject: Lierature on Arabic military culture?         Reply with quote

Hello from a long time lurker.

For a while now I've been trying to find books or articles about the Moorish or Arabic military ways in the medieval times. Or even before that. English preferred, but I could probably make some sense of German or French writings leaning heavily on the dictionary. So far I've not had much luck, but could well be that I have not known where to look.

I would greatly appreciate any information on the subject.

Many thanks in advance,

-n.
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Sam Barris




Location: San Diego, California
Joined: 29 Apr 2004
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Posts: 617

PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 5:00 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I found a book on Amazon called Arab Historians of the Crusades; a compilation of several contemporary accounts (I personally always go to period histories first). There is also The Crusades Through Arab Eyes, which I found to be a bit... I guess fluffy might be the best word. The first one will no doubt give you a guide for further reading, since it's all lifted from original manuscripts. Speaking of original manuscripts, I once saw a series called Crusade Texts in Translation on a professor's bookshelf. At least one of them was Arab in origin, if I remember correctly.
Pax,
Sam Barris

"Any nation that draws too great a distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools." —Thucydides
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Werner Stiegler





Joined: 27 Feb 2007

Posts: 122

PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 10:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There's a translated mamluk military manual somewhere on the net. Pretty interesting, but I'll be damned if I could remember where I've seen it though.
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Peter Lyon
Industry Professional



Location: New Zealand
Joined: 20 Nov 2006
Reading list: 39 books

Posts: 229

PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 10:45 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Werner Stiegler wrote:
There's a translated mamluk military manual somewhere on the net. Pretty interesting, but I'll be damned if I could remember where I've seen it though.


That could be "Medieval Muslim Horsemanship" by G Rex Smith. A short but useful book.

Still hammering away
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Adam Rose





Joined: 23 Aug 2003
Reading list: 17 books

Posts: 32

PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 1:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Werner Stiegler wrote:
There's a translated mamluk military manual somewhere on the net. Pretty interesting, but I'll be damned if I could remember where I've seen it though.


De Re Militari?

A Muslim Manual of War from the Fourteenth Century: http://www.deremilitari.org/resources/sources/muslimmanual.htm

The Skill of Archery from a 14th century Mamluk-Kipchak Military Treatise: http://www.deremilitari.org/resources/sources/archery.htm
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Sa'ar Nudel




Location: Haifa, Israel
Joined: 02 Dec 2005
Likes: 16 pages

Posts: 354

PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 2:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kitab al Furusiyyah wa al Manasib al Harbiyya ("On Horsemanship and Devices of War") of Hasan Al Rammah, from 1270. A translation (to French?) was published in 1998 but I don't know if it's available to the general public.

There is a book of post-medieval period (I think early 17th century) which is a martial manual of the Ottoman army, with many plates. This book of rather extra-large scale exists as a facsimile, unfortunately I cannot recall its name.

I also suggest to go through the vast bibliography of David Nicolle.

Curator of Beit Ussishkin, regional nature & history museum, Upper Galilee.
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Gavin Kisebach




Location: Lacey, Wa US
Joined: 01 Aug 2004

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PostPosted: Mon 09 Mar, 2009 7:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There is some interesting information here, including references to Hasan Al Rammah:

http://www.history-science-technology.com/Art...es%202.htm

There are only two kinds of scholars; those who love ideas and those who hate them. ~ Emile Chartier
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Werner Stiegler





Joined: 27 Feb 2007

Posts: 122

PostPosted: Tue 10 Mar, 2009 7:00 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Found it. Keith Nelson, a Swordforum-user posted parts of the thesis: "A 14th Century Mamluk-Kipchak Military Treatise - Munyatu'I-Guzat"

http://forums.swordforum.com/showthread.php?t...luk+manual

Sadly, the Pdf's not available online anymore. It was a most interesting manual dealing with riding, fighting with the lance and the bow mostly. The parts about swords dealt with typology and only offered minimal advice on how to actually use the weapon though.
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N. Prauda




Location: Finland
Joined: 10 Jan 2008

Posts: 14

PostPosted: Wed 11 Mar, 2009 1:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thank you very much for all the answers.

I ordered "Arab Historians of the Crusades" from Amazon and am eagerly awaiting delivery. Period texts would be my first choice, as well.

Thanks again,
-n.
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Lafayette C Curtis




Location: Indonesia
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Reading list: 7 books

Posts: 2,689

PostPosted: Wed 18 Mar, 2009 7:46 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Kurtulus Oztopcu's translation of the Munyatu'l Ghuzat is still in print:

http://www.oztopcu.com/books/mamluk-kipchak-military.htm

http://en.eren.com.tr/goster/kitap/kisi.asp?C...3159166297
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