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Brawn Barber




Location: In the shop
Joined: 20 Nov 2008

Posts: 60

PostPosted: Wed 07 Jan, 2009 5:37 pm    Post subject: European Scale Armour         Reply with quote

For you Highlander Ninja fans

http://gladius.revistas.csic.es/index.php/gla...File/21/22
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Matthew Amt




Location: Laurel, MD, USA
Joined: 17 Sep 2003

Posts: 1,306

PostPosted: Thu 08 Jan, 2009 7:16 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

VERY intriguing, thanks for posting that! I wonder if they'd let me wear a shirt of scale armor at Jamestown? Hmmm.... The author does seem to know his scale armor!

Matthew
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Thu 08 Jan, 2009 4:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Interesting post, Brawn.

I'd agree with the author that perhaps this was an antiquated piece adapted for use by a soldier of little means. It might have been handed down in his family for a few generations for all we know. It's unfortunate that we can never know the owner's story and the truth about how his armor ended up in the New Mexico sagebrush centuries ago.

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Josh Warren




Location: Manhattan, Kansas
Joined: 01 Nov 2006

Posts: 111

PostPosted: Sat 10 Jan, 2009 6:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There exists--apparently unknown to the author of this article--at least one 15th century Spanish funeral effigy depicting a man in a full armour consisting of a scale coat worn with full plate arm and leg defenses. Clearly, there was a small surviving tradition of scale body armour in Christian Iberia from whence this defense may have issued. I cannot at present call to mind the name of the man whose effigy it is, but I believe that Osprey's "Knights of Christ" book featured a photo of it.

EDIT: Found it:

http://books.google.com/books?id=s_xam_KxitUC...;ct=result

Martin Vasquez de Arce, a brother-knight of the order of Santiago: metal scale body armour in a late 15th century Western European (and specifically Iberian) context.

Non Concedo
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Brawn Barber




Location: In the shop
Joined: 20 Nov 2008

Posts: 60

PostPosted: Thu 15 Jan, 2009 7:00 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sounds your wheels are turning for another book, Jonathan!

Thanks for the feedback guys. I was glued to this article when I first saw it. Kinda surprised that it hasn't been commented on by many others.

Brawn
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Gabriele A. Pini




Location: Olgiate Comasco, Como
Joined: 02 Sep 2008

Posts: 239

PostPosted: Thu 15 Jan, 2009 7:12 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Can't this be one influence fom Arabs? They used scale armor through the entire medieval age, and Spain was very influenced by their dominion (like in the use of small bows).
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Brawn Barber




Location: In the shop
Joined: 20 Nov 2008

Posts: 60

PostPosted: Thu 15 Jan, 2009 10:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Could be, Gabriele.

My original inference was that armour located as evidence anywhere does not necessarily mean that it is strickly due to venue, If that were the case we'd be able to say now that native American Indians manufactued lined scale armour. This is not so much a reach as to say that leather scale armour could not have migrated in a millenium across a continent. This more strongly suggests that the early scale armour from Eurasia could have easily made its way to Europe between the time of 6 Century BC and the Viking era. I think when the question arises "did the Vikings wear leather scale armour?" or was there scale armour in Medieval Europe Io think the answer should not be "No, because there is no evidence but rather "We do not know" as a more accurate answer. Again the speculatiion must be noted, however I also will remain steadfast in my "speculation" that there is also intelligent life on another planet in the universe.

When we confine ourselves to what we can know and of which we have documented proof, we limit ourselves to the possibilities that may exist, rather than what we see or read.
Brawn
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