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Chase S-R




Location: New Mexico
Joined: 31 Jan 2008

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PostPosted: Wed 27 Aug, 2008 11:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I recently read Mr. Arnow's review of the A&A Aunlaz dagger, I have been planning to purchase this dagger and was wondering about the scabbord you can buy. How tight is the fit, could you wear it angled downwards? Does it spin or flip hilt down when worn alone?
Secondly I was wondering about the medieval knife. The scabbord looks quite different from the one on A&A's website have they changed it or was this just a request?

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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Wed 27 Aug, 2008 2:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chase S-R wrote:
I recently read Mr. Arnow's review of the A&A Aunlaz dagger, I have been planning to purchase this dagger and was wondering about the scabbord you can buy. How tight is the fit, could you wear it angled downwards? Does it spin or flip hilt down when worn alone?
Secondly I was wondering about the medieval knife. The scabbord looks quite different from the one on A&A's website have they changed it or was this just a request?


Chase,
Whether you can wear it point down depends on the dagger. The Aunlaz fits tightly and the hilt is light. It probably wouldn't slip out, though I haven't tempted fate (and risked my feet) by trying it. Happy The Classic dagger's hilt is a little different and has more mass. The fit on the scabbard is still pretty tight, but I'd be less trusting of wearing it with the hilt angled downwards. Even when the hilt tipped down on the Classic Dager, the dagger didn't fall right out. With some jostling, it might work its way loose over time. Past A&A dagger scabbards, in my experience, didn't fit as well or look as nice as the current ones.

My scabbard for the Medieval Knife is a very simple one, and different than their current offerings. It had no suspension loop. I added one after I took the photos for that review last year. The only real difference may be the loop. A&A would be a better source to ask, though.

If you want something different than standard, just ask A&A and I'm sure they'd be willing to discuss doing it. A small upcharge might apply, like with the tooling I had done on the two recent ones I bought.

Happy

ChadA

http://chadarnow.com/


Last edited by Chad Arnow on Wed 27 Aug, 2008 2:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Wed 27 Aug, 2008 2:51 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chase S-R wrote:
I recently read Mr. Arnow's review of the A&A Aunlaz dagger, I have been planning to purchase this dagger and was wondering about the scabbord you can buy. How tight is the fit, could you wear it angled downwards? Does it spin or flip hilt down when worn alone?
Secondly I was wondering about the medieval knife. The scabbord looks quite different from the one on A&A's website have they changed it or was this just a request?


The fit might be tight or a little bit lose but I easily fixed mine by cutting a little square of leather and gluing it on the inside at the mouth of the scabbard to tighten it up to a friction fit: The knife will stay in the scabbard if held upsidedown but will fall out if shaken. It does balance on the belt with the dagger staying vertical but it will flop a bit and not too sure about it if one is running.

I would use the loop as a safety but would have the scabbard between the belt and my waist or in between the loops of a belt bag.

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James Barker




Location: Ashburn VA
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PostPosted: Thu 28 Aug, 2008 12:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

At minimum a dagger sheath should be two layers of leather; for a really high end dagger a wood core is appropriate as well as metal fittings of gold or silver.

The inside layer can be made of junky leather and the stitching on it often is quick and dirty. The important part is that the smooth side (the hide side) is against the blade and the split (suede side) faces out.

The outside layer needs to be of good leather. The hide side will be out. The seem in the back can either be butted together and flesh edge stitched or can have the exposed seem that is a running stitch.

I am working on a sheath for a basilard dagger I picked up at Pennsic now; I will post some pictures when I am done. I am making custom stamps for the tooling currently. Project may take a few weeks as I have a pouch and shoe order to fill in the next week.

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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Tue 02 Sep, 2008 1:00 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James Barker wrote:
I am making custom stamps for the tooling currently. Project may take a few weeks as I have a pouch and shoe order to fill in the next week.


Now that part I am VERY interested in (the other part is interesting too, but I just bought an entire book on how to do that bit) So if I might be so bold as to ask just how does one go about doing that? Or alternately does one intend to sell such things?

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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Tue 02 Sep, 2008 1:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James,
Are you describing historical sheaths? I've never heard them described in such detail before, as I didn't think we had a ton of info to go off of.

Happy

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James Barker




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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 6:41 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Russ Ellis wrote:
Now that part I am VERY interested in (the other part is interesting too, but I just bought an entire book on how to do that bit) So if I might be so bold as to ask just how does one go about doing that? Or alternately does one intend to sell such things?


Russ

I am using a sharpe knife, hand saw, small files, chisels, and sand paper to make some of the simple stamps you see in Knives and Scabbards. I picked up some hardwood dowels at home depot to carve the shapes into. After so much usage thye get a bit smashed and have to be touched up but they make a nice stamp.

Chad Arnow wrote:
James,
Are you describing historical sheaths? I've never heard them described in such detail before, as I didn't think we had a ton of info to go off of.


You are correct there is not a ton of good info but there is some. The double layer of leather is in Knives and Scabbards. There is some info in other books I will have to dig all the names up. Also talk to folks like Mark Guakler who examined some sheaths over seas; he posted info here a while back.

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Chase S-R




Location: New Mexico
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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 11:26 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I was just wondering how the dagger sheaths come and whether A&A had changed the knife sheaths.
a good book for learning how to tool and sew leather is the boyscout leatherworking merit badge handbook, it even explains how to vegetable tan your own leather.
I saw in a museum remanants of a linnen covered wool lined wood cored scabbord with gold fittings for a rondel dagger a

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Sean Flynt
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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 12:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James Barker wrote:

Russ

I am using a sharpe knife, hand saw, small files, chisels, and sand paper to make some of the simple stamps you see in Knives and Scabbards. I picked up some hardwood dowels at home depot to carve the shapes into. After so much usage thye get a bit smashed and have to be touched up but they make a nice stamp.


I recently used an identical method for a German longsword chappe. I wanted a star pattern inspired by a work of 15th c. German art, but not something neat and modern-looking because the decorated chappes on which I was basing mine had relatively crude stamping/incising. I cut a short length of oak dowel and cut notches around the circumference of one end (knife or triangular file--I don't recall which,) with the narrow end of the notch near the center. That made a simple star/asterisk design. Then I put the dyed leather on my anvil and just tapped the dowel lightly with a hammer. For the line along the bottom edge of the chappe I think I just used the edge of a metal ruler or something similar. No measuring or great care. Turned out fine--authentically crude, I think. I'll second James' observation about wear and tear on such stamps. Mine is good for a bit longer if I need it, but it's .25" stock and probably would split with extended use. Thicker stock and a wooden mallet would extend life.

By the way, I think a large nail set would make an excellent tool for making circles like those on Chad's scabbard. That or a section of thin-wall tubing from the hardware store. With the small circle of a nail set, you could make a nice diamond and circle pattern, maybe, with broad cross-hatching and the little circle in the middle of each resulting diamond. You certainly wouldn't have to worry about wearing out that tool.



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-Sean

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James Barker




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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 1:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks good Sean; the size is in line with medieval sizes. Did you hammer your leather dry or did you case it first?
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Sean Flynt
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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 2:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James Barker wrote:
Looks good Sean; the size is in line with medieval sizes. Did you hammer your leather dry or did you case it first?


I don't recall whether I dyed first and stamped before the leather was fully dry or stamped on slightly moistened, un-dyed leather, then dyed. Whichever method I finally used, the leather was cased (slightly moistened) when I stamped. I experimented with scraps and different degrees of wet first, refining my stamp and hammer force at the same time. I'd encourage everybody else to do likewise. By the way, the dye was the brush-on type, so the leather was never soaked through by any means. I don't know what effect rain would have on my rain guard, but I don't intend to find out. Big Grin I assume these were waxed, historically, and I waxed mine.

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PostPosted: Wed 03 Sep, 2008 2:21 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Typically, oak/vegetable-tanned leather is tooled/ stamped/ etc. while undyed / untreated. For most tooling (cutting/carving) or stamping, it is almost always dry or very slightly moistened. This ensures crisp results without the malforming caused by changes happening in the drying process, etc. For some types of this sort of manipulation, it is done wet but almost never with stampings and things that require a "hit". The dry worked leather is then dyed, sealed, and otherwise finished and treated.
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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Thu 04 Sep, 2008 8:33 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James Barker wrote:

Russ

I am using a sharpe knife, hand saw, small files, chisels, and sand paper to make some of the simple stamps you see in Knives and Scabbards. I picked up some hardwood dowels at home depot to carve the shapes into. After so much usage thye get a bit smashed and have to be touched up but they make a nice stamp.



Drat, you know I've got the book, I've read it, I recall looking carefully at the section on stamps... and I've somehow managed to completely forget anything on actually MAKING stamps. I can do it this way, but I would be better off with a stock of metal stamps I expect considering the volumes I generally work with. I've been trying to find a way to avoid having custom metal stamps made as they are HORRIDLY expensive but I may just have to suck it up and make the investment! Thanks for the insight.

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