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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2007 7:33 am    Post subject: Surviving examples of transitional great helms         Reply with quote

Are there surviving examples of those masked helms that will in between conical Norman helms and true great helms? We see them in 12th and 13th century art, but I can't recall any surviving examples.

Anyone know of any?

Thanks!

Happy

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Randall Moffett




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2007 8:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I think we base them on only artwork really. There are some eastern european helmets with face plates but most are much later. I have never heard of a remaining one though.

sorry,

RPM
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Bruno Giordan





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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2007 2:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Surviving examples of transitional great helms         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:
Are there surviving examples of those masked helms that will in between conical Norman helms and true great helms? We see them in 12th and 13th century art, but I can't recall any surviving examples.

Anyone know of any?

Thanks!


I wish there were some ...


We can put hope in an archeological find or in a new Chalcis hoard ... from the XII century.
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Steven H




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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2007 3:51 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Anyone have some examples from the art? Now that I'm looking for one I can't seem to find them.

Thanks.

Kunstbruder - Boston area Historical Combat Study
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 05 Jul, 2007 8:07 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Steven H wrote:
Anyone have some examples from the art? Now that I'm looking for one I can't seem to find them.

Thanks.


Here's one, from our Spotlight Article on Oakeshott's Type XII:



This appears to be one:



(from: http://www.angelfire.com/wy/svenskildbiter/ar...chelm.html)

There are a lot more out there, too.

Happy

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Damien Pinel





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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jul, 2007 4:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Steven H wrote:
Anyone have some examples from the art? Now that I'm looking for one I can't seem to find them.

Thanks.


Here: http://jmebert.free.fr/Fiches/Fiche_H2.htm

A very talented french armor maker makes them. It is his website.
There are many examples of this type of transition helmets on period seals. You should look that way.
This is a very important period, the half faced helmet, which were rare through the end of the XIIth century, start to be very appreciated, and they are protecting the face, and then the ears, and then the back of the head.

Damien Pinel
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Bruno Giordan





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PostPosted: Fri 06 Jul, 2007 11:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

From the famous Charlemagne reliquiary


 Attachment: 116.42 KB
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Randall Moffett




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PostPosted: Sat 07 Jul, 2007 12:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is another for you of a seal. The full info in on the British Museum online.

http://www.thebritishmuseum.ac.uk/explore/hig...page=23096

RPM
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