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Aaron Schnatterly
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 Posted: Fri 09 Mar, 2007 6:12 am Post subject: |
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| Edward Hitchens wrote: | | Wow!! Judging by those pictures, I'd say this one's been worth the wait! I take it one of those belongs to Aaron? If I recall, he bagged Munich #1 (out of 500). |
Actually, I pushed swords I have on order down the production list in favor of customer orders. (All of us here did, actually.) I think I'm #15 or 20 now. Rather see this out there in your hands...
My thought - this is a beauty - deceptively elegant - probably the most lethal piece I've handled for the 15th C longsword arts... I could comment on it's outstanding tip control, quick-quick nature, wickedly advantageous leverage, and other nice little attributes, but that'd be spoiling the fun... 
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Jean Thibodeau
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| Posted: Fri 09 Mar, 2007 7:03 am Post subject: |
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| Aaron Schnatterly wrote: | | Edward Hitchens wrote: | | Wow!! Judging by those pictures, I'd say this one's been worth the wait! I take it one of those belongs to Aaron? If I recall, he bagged Munich #1 (out of 500). |
Actually, I pushed swords I have on order down the production list in favor of customer orders. (All of us here did, actually.) I think I'm #15 or 20 now. Rather see this out there in your hands...
My thought - this is a beauty - deceptively elegant - probably the most lethal piece I've handled for the 15th C longsword arts... I could comment on it's outstanding tip control, quick-quick nature, wickedly advantageous leverage, and other nice little attributes, but that'd be spoiling the fun... |
Well that is impressive self-sacrifice.  One consolation, I guess, is that you don't have to have your own sword to get a feel for a new model while you wait to get one for yourself.
Nice to see you post again.  Even if you probably don't have much time to do it often.
( So, just a quick " off topic " hello. )
You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Edward Hitchens
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| Posted: Fri 09 Mar, 2007 7:40 am Post subject: |
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| Allen Andrews wrote: | | I think it would be cool to have both swords reviewed by the same hand to see how this spells out in regards to handling. |
 Excellent idea!!
We've had similar reviews like that such as bronze and steel versions of A&A's Edward III sword (leave it to me to bring up that sword again ). Since the Munich only just came out, I realize such a review wouldn't be for awhile. But definitely run it by Chad & Nathan! Oh, BTW, nice to hear from you Aaron!
"The whole art of government consists in the art of being honest." Thomas Jefferson
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Sean Flynt
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Jeremy V. Krause
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| Posted: Fri 09 Mar, 2007 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Sean Flynt wrote: | | Is there any "up" left? |
I really love albion's product but certainly there is an "up". I believe that using actual under cording in the NG line hilts would be a great step forward and, I feel, is warranted given the gradual and significant price increase. The wire wrap on the Munich is very attractive and I would like to see some of this attention given as an option on other models- I wouuld be very willing to pay for this.
In any case- Howy and everyone at albion, though the Munich does not fall into my era of interest it really is a very beautiful and graceful sword.
Jeremy
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Derek Wassom
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| Posted: Fri 09 Mar, 2007 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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Looks great! I can't wait for mine. The wire grip looks nice, but I can't afford it. Is there any chance of you doing this on the Fiore?
Regards,
Derek Wassom
Luegisland Scholar
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Cornelius Engelhardt
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Gary Grzybek
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| Posted: Tue 13 Mar, 2007 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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Wow!
I love both versions and would have trouble deciding which way to go. That's sure one elegant and deadly design.
Gary Grzybek
ARMA Northern N.J.
www.armastudy.org
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Stephane Rabier
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| Posted: Wed 14 Mar, 2007 1:18 am Post subject: |
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Hello,
I see something like a pattern on the original grip, is it leather or fabric?
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Cornelius Engelhardt
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| Posted: Wed 14 Mar, 2007 4:48 am Post subject: |
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| Stephane Rabier wrote: | Hello,
I see something like a pattern on the original grip, is it leather or fabric? |
It's tooled leather.
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Gabriel Lebec
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Wed 14 Mar, 2007 5:19 am Post subject: |
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I've been waiting for this update for a long time. I currently have $500 credit with Albion, and in the time it's been sitting there have watched the price increase(s?) on the Regent with more than a little chagrin. But besides finances, what really held me off on finishing the purchase was this sword - I wanted to see how it would turn out.
Well, it appears to have turned out fantastic! The decision between the two models is harder than ever, and the addition of a wire grip option is a pleasant surprise to say the least. I look forward to the inevitable reviews, photos, and comparisons. Now I just need to scrounge up the balance... looks like I picked the wrong year to indulge my audiophile hobby .
To everyone at Albion: congrats on the sword!
-GLL
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Stephane Rabier
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| Posted: Wed 14 Mar, 2007 7:23 am Post subject: |
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| Cornelius Engelhardt wrote: | | It's tooled leather. |
Thanks Cornelius.
That sword is really wonderful!
That's too bad my wife won't tolerate me to buy another toy as I'm already waiting for a Czeck one and a half sword 
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Brian M
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| Posted: Wed 14 Mar, 2007 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Allen Andrews wrote: | | I do notice that the wire wrap slightly effects the weight of the sword and the CoG, I think it would be cool to have both swords reviewed by the same hand to see how this spells out in regards to handling. |
It seems to me that it would be a fairly simply matter to make the CoGs match by grinding down the annular faces of the pommel. The weights would still be slightly different as more of the wire-wrapped-grip's mass is closer to the fulcrum, but the CoG at least could be made identical. Done carefully you probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference without a micrometer.
Brian M
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Jared Smith
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| Posted: Thu 15 Mar, 2007 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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I have been hoping something would be added to the sales description about the origin and time period of this sword. I believe Albion attributes this as an Oakeshott type XXVIIIb, mid 15th to early 16th century. In the photos it seems to be grouped near an early rapier/ longsword with ring guard and I am thinking this may actually be appropriate.
Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence!
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Jared Smith
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| Posted: Thu 15 Mar, 2007 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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Another pleasant surprise as of the last few minutes...
My reserve order for the plain wrap grip Munich has been completed and is now shipping!
Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence!
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Michael Edelson
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| Posted: Fri 16 Mar, 2007 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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The sword is beautiful...I really like it (make that love it).
I have a question, however...why is this particular sword so expensive? There is no hollow grinding or complex pommel that require extensive hand work...in fact from looking at it, I would say that this sword requires no more work to finish than an Agincourt or Talhoffer, and far less, for example, than the Regent or Earl. The Earl requires less than the Regent because of its simpler pommel, and so it is cheaper. Following that logic, the Munich should cost about seven to eight hundred dollars.
Is there something I'm missing from the photos?
New York Historical Fencing Association
www.newyorklongsword.com
Byakkokan Dojo
http://newyorkbattodo.com/
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Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Fri 16 Mar, 2007 12:52 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Michael!
Good that you brought this point up.
There is one important aspect that puts this sword apart from many in the NG line.
The Munich is built very close to the original sword.
The design benefits from personal researh on the original and the blade is within fractions of a milimeter of the original. Even if it does not meet the standards of the Museum Line, this sword is still benefitting from extensive and expansive research.
You get a sword that is not only a very realistic recreation of a late medieval sword, it is also a paritcularly nice example of the type.
How many swords, production or custom are based on this level of research?
It would not have been posible to make this sword unless countless of hours have gone into the analysis of the documentation material.
The only way to fund original research by making swords is to have the price reflect some of the labour and time that has gone into the development of the piece.
Simple shapes and clean lines might seem pretty straight forward but are often more demanding to produce as there is nothing to hide behind. Everything shows. No mistake can be blurred out. It is like chamber music, where each instrument is a soloist.
Just look at the narrow flat in the upper third of the midrib: it is pretty daunting to grind. You cannot slip or push it anywhere, or the whole blade might be ruined. The point on this blade is also demanding. It is narrow and quite thick: to avoid overgrinding and overheating takes awareness and care.
The S-curved guard demands a steady even motion or there will be ridges and waves in the surface, and nothing to hide them with if you are to avoid overgrinding and destruction of the shape.
Even if the details can look deceivingly simple, it is how they come together that makes or breaks the sword. Everything has to be finished just so.
I would ask you to find any other production sword built with the same level of attention to detial in all stages from original research to dedication in production.
This is what sums up to a price.
The price is higher than many other in the line, but it is really not expensive for what you get.
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Michael Edelson
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| Posted: Fri 16 Mar, 2007 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Peter,
That makes sense. I did not realize it was that closely based on the original. Fractions of a milimeter...that's fantastic! This model sort of blurs the line between your next gen line and Museum lines, does it not?
| Quote: | | I would ask you to find any other production sword built with the same level of attention to detial in all stages from original research to dedication in production. |
Excluding the research portion which I know little about and judging solely on the finished products, I would say it's fairly easy to find production swords that match this one. Just go to the Albion website. 
Mike
New York Historical Fencing Association
www.newyorklongsword.com
Byakkokan Dojo
http://newyorkbattodo.com/
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Jared Smith
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| Posted: Fri 16 Mar, 2007 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Peter Johnsson wrote: |
There is one important aspect that puts this sword apart from many in the NG line.
The Munich is built very close to the original sword. The design benefits from personal researh on the original and the blade is within fractions of a milimeter of the original. Even if it does not meet the standards of the Museum Line, this sword is still benefitting from extensive and expansive research. The price is higher than many other in the line, but it is really not expensive for what you get. |
I thought pretty hard about my initial order for this sword. The guard is not my favorite "look" . But I have zero experience with them and actually expect this one to grow on me to a point where I love it. I am trying to refrain from putting any words into Peter's mouth that he never actually said. I noticed on some other older sword forums that Peter had posted on this sword in a manner that it appeared to be something of a personal favorite (my intuition, not Peter's words.) That alone would be a selling point for me (given my respect for his experience and knowledge from researching and handling a large number of actual historic swords.)
Looking closely at the point or tip of the Munich sword, that alone is much more complex than a simple awl shape or straight tapered spike. Some of the Albion models (my Sempach comes to mind) actually have a point with a phenomenal balance of structural strength (not easy to break in cutting on hard wood which I have done with the point of my Sempach) while penetrating soft targets (water filled milk jugs for example) in thrust with only "feather" weight effort. At least my particular Sempach could be a magician's prop as I can thrust it into a water filled jug and leave it there with hardly any noticeable leakage of water escaping through the cuts. This alone is a "marvel" of craftsmanship that one will not likely replicate with items priced at a much lower point, or produced by artisans lacking a sincere passion for what they are making. There is a tremendous amount of complexity involving design, final grinding and polishing labor going into achieving these traits, that probably will not be fully appreciated by anyone who has not attempted to make their own sword.
Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence!
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Sam Barris
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| Posted: Sat 17 Mar, 2007 11:30 am Post subject: |
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I just found this picture of the original out of its case in the photo archive! I'd never seen it not behind glass. Absolutely beautiful. And the reproduction looks like a worthy successor.
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/photo/962.html
Pax,
Sam Barris
"Any nation that draws too great a distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools." —Thucydides
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This is a standard topic