Posts: 8,310 Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
Mon 02 Oct, 2006 7:51 pm
| Steve Grisetti wrote: |
| The Windlass/Factory X Sword of Dracula has been mentioned a few times in this thread. I finally got tired of the poorly-sewn, vinyl-over-plastic grip, and tore it off. One of these days, I'll get a new grip on it. In the meantime, though, here is a photo of the tang, which seems pretty substantial to me. |
As long as this tang has radiused corners it looks strong enough. Personally I like tangs to be as strong as possible as the tang should be the last place prone to break I.M.H.O.
So, strong enough, but as strong as it could be :?: I guess there is an upper limit for any sword where a too big or heavy a tang would make for too thick a grip or might affect handling negatively.
Posts: 782 Location: Upstate New York
Tue 03 Oct, 2006 6:03 am
Jean Thibodeau wrote:
| Quote: |
As long as this tang has radiused corners it looks strong enough. Personally I like tangs to be as strong as possible as the tang should be the last place prone to break I.M.H.O.
|
Hello all!
Jean,
I forgot to thank you for welcoming me to the site and wishing me luck with my novel. Sorry!
Thanks!
Now, the lack of a proper radius at the corners where the shoulders of the blade meet the tang is still a problem with MRL swords. Out of all the various MRL swords I've taken apart, only the Patay had a small but nicely formed radius. It's a pity that one wasn't assembled in a more traditional manner; it would have been a much nicer sword if the tang end was peened instead of being threaded. The pommel just screwed on.
The lack of a radius where the tang meets the shoulders in the Towton and Shrewsbury could explain the few stories of breakages with these models. I forgot to mention in my previous post about tightening MRL grips that you should probably file a radius into the tang-shoulder juncture if the sword is to see somewhat heavy use.
Stay safe!
Posts: 599 Location: Brooklyn, NY
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 12:08 pm
| Richard Fay wrote: |
Vassilis,
Like I said above, I don't have pictures of what I do to tighten Windlass swords, but I might be able to describe it for you. It's not a perfect fix, but it helps! ..........I hope this rambling helps!
Stay safe! |
Thanks for that info Richard.
Steve I have always wondered about that Dracula Sword. I had considered buying it myself. How does it handle? have you done any hard-practice with it?
The tang does look substantial for a single hand sword but I agree with Jean in that I'll take my tangs as strong as I can get them. I have never experienced a single hand sword breaking in all my practice. I have really pushed my single hand swords too by cupping my off-hand over my swordhand for many strikes. The cupped hand strikes don't seem to stress the tang the way a two-handed grip does. The shorter tang length adds a strength quality. It seems that all the trouble is with the hand and half swords. What I have noticed in examining swords is that the tang on the hand and half's is often just as thick as the single sword tangs...that makes no sense when you are applying twice the torque.
Posts: 782 Location: Upstate New York
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 2:27 pm
regarding the Drac...
Hello all!
Vassilis,
I hope I'm not stepping on any toes here by leaping in yet again (sorry, Steve, if I'm butting ahead of you), but I would recommend checking out the review of MRL's Medieval Short Sword right here on this site. The Dracula Sword and the Medieval Short Sword are basically one and the same. I agree with the reviews assessment; I've found the "Drac" to be fairly light and fairly well balanced. I also like that the wide blade and mid-rib at the point impart a nice stiffness to the blade. I believe that this is one Windlass sword that would make a decent thruster. You would have to get information about how this sword handles cutting from someone else, I've never cut with mine. (Is there such a thing as "shadow sword fighting?)
The Dracula Sword did come with a "real cool" coffin plaque (made into a Halloween decoration), complete with a candle holder! MRL used to sell the plaque separately for a while.
A final word regarding the Drac, MRL has not had that model in stock for quite some time. You would have to purchase one used if you want that particular sword.
Check out the review!
Stay safe!
Posts: 599 Location: Brooklyn, NY
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 2:56 pm
Thank you Richard. I will read the review. I was not aware that it was the same sword.
I am searching "Windlass/Factory X Sword " but I am unable to find the reivew. Could someone please give me a
link. Thanks.
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 4:15 pm
Well as far as the Paul Chen Lowlander Two Handed Great Sword goes, there is nothing "great" about it other than it's immense size, but I sure would not want to have to rely on this "sword" (cough) for my life or the defense of others.
After attempting to split some 2 by 6 pieces of lumber down the center the tang broke in half :mad: very proximal to the crossguard. These sword companies that spend time and energy on making a relatively superior blade seem to totally miss the importance of the tang. Obviously, I will be seeking a refund or exchange, whatever best I can achieve.
Beyond that of an eye catching wall hanger I now find this sword to be utterly worthless.
Sincerely,
Bob
Posts: 11,553 Location: San Francisco
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 4:31 pm
| Bob Burns wrote: |
Well as far as the Paul Chen Lowlander Two Handed Great Sword goes, there is nothing "great" about it other than it's immense size, but I sure would not want to have to rely on this "sword" (cough) for my life or the defense of others.
After attempting to split some 2 by 6 pieces of lumber down the center the tang broke in half :mad: very proximal to the crossguard. These sword companies that spend time and energy on making a relatively superior blade seem to totally miss the importance of the tang. Obviously, I will be seeking a refund or exchange, whatever best I can achieve.
Beyond that of an eye catching wall hanger I now find this sword to be utterly worthless.
|
I didn't realize you bought the Lowlander...
Splitting wood is a task best left to axes. No sword was designed to split wood. If I made a sword and my customer broke it using it to split wood of any size, I would personally not refund the money. It's probably a good thing I don't make swords for customers. :)
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 4:37 pm
Axes are for wood true, splitting down the length of the board with the grain I did not expect the tang to break, I am no metalurgist but looking at it, it sure seems to me as though the tang was never tempered. Looks very grainy so to speak.
Ah well. Yeah I just picked up today and just had to try something out with it. Win some, ya lose some.
Bob
Posts: 11,553 Location: San Francisco
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 4:48 pm
| Bob Burns wrote: |
Axes are for wood true, splitting down the length of the board with the grain I did not expect the tang to break, I am no metalurgist but looking at it, it sure seems to me as though the tang was never tempered. Looks very grainy so to speak.
Ah well. Yeah I just picked up today and just had to try something out with it. Win some, ya lose some. |
We're getting way off-topic here, but it's important to note that historic tangs are often left unhardened for the very purpose of leaving them with more flex. A overly-hard or brittle tang is not often a good thing.
Anyway, I've no doubt that the CASI Lowlander has a sub-par tang configuration. Mine sure does. I knew that when I purchased mine. At sub-$200, I wasn't expecting to get a sword of superior quality, and certainly not one that I'd use for tasks not intended for even the best of swords. Further, the sword arrived with the cross-guard unattached and needed assembly. My sword's tang was clearly visible and I could see exactly what it was.
Having said all that, I'm going to reitterate to those reading this: swords are not intened to split wood just as screwdrives aren't used to hammer nails. Sure, they can do it, and will often do it with success: but you're asking for trouble doing it. You will get bit.
It's very important to emphasize that fact so that others will not get hurt.
Posts: 8,310 Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 5:15 pm
| Bob Burns wrote: |
Axes are for wood true, splitting down the length of the board with the grain I did not expect the tang to break, I am no metalurgist but looking at it, it sure seems to me as though the tang was never tempered. Looks very grainy so to speak.
Ah well. Yeah I just picked up today and just had to try something out with it. Win some, ya lose some.
Bob |
I tend to agree with Nathan that splitting wood is at least somewhere in the grey zone between use and abuse but all sorts of factors might make a big difference: Type of wood, length of wood to be split and how committed a swing was taken.
On the other hand a good tang might have survived if the sword was merely accelerated down without trying to overpower it through the board ( Not that I assume you did overpower it ). Also, this doesn't inspire much confidence in the tang of this sword.
If my life depended on the structural integrity of a sword I might want to do the splitting of wood a handful of times before having confidence in it.
Bob, I agree with your puzzlement / displeasure with makers who ruin an otherwise perfectly good sword by saving a few pennies making a flimsy tang or not radiusing the tang at the shoulders of the blade or by bad heat treating.
I guess this sword might still be O.K. if one only wants / needs a wallhanger.
But if I was the vendor hearing " splitting wood " I would jump to the conclusion of abuse. :eek: :( even if it was done at a moderate intensity well within what a good sword should be able to survive if one doesn't make a habit of it.
(Edited after reading Nathan's last post that happened while I was writing: Maybe a using sword would need to be tested but there may be better more sword appropriate ways to test a sword. A sword might survive an inappropriate test but might be weakened by it so that it might not survive a second attempt or might accumulate microfractures i.e. metal fatigue. )
Last edited by Jean Thibodeau on Wed 04 Oct, 2006 5:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
Posts: 9,545 Location: Dayton, OH
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 5:16 pm
| Vassilis Tsafatinos wrote: |
Thank you Richard. I will read the review. I was not aware that it was the same sword.
I am searching "Windlass/Factory X Sword " but I am unable to find the reivew. Could someone please give me a
link. Thanks. |
It's on the reviews page under "Medieval Short Sword."
Posts: 1,812 Location: Orlando metro area, Florida, USA
Wed 04 Oct, 2006 5:36 pm
| Vassilis Tsafatinos wrote: |
| ... Steve I have always wondered about that Dracula Sword. I had considered buying it myself. How does it handle? have you done any hard-practice with it? .... |
I have not done any cutting with the sword. It still has the Windlass factory edge on it, as well as the standard lacquer finish. I think that the Drac handles reasonably well, even neglecting the ridiculously low price I paid for it. However, I suspect that it would feel somewhat sluggish, if compared with a top quality production sword of similar size.
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 12:29 pm
:lol: Well I sent a short email of inquiry as to what my position would be on the Lowlander and Ryan said almost exactly the same thing Nathan did, that wood is for axes not for swords! :lol: Not for one second would I misrepresent the facts to where I bought the sword, so it's up to me whether I want to replace it or not. But this tells me one thing, this sword would never hold up in battle.
Shields are made of wood and we all know that swords strike shields in battle, so if a sword is not meant to strike wood then how can it be battle ready? :D I find this kind of humorous actually, I mean when you think about it.
Bob
Posts: 44 Location: Kalamazoo, MI, USA
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 1:11 pm
But are
shields made of 2x6 lumber? I'm not necessarily defending the sword, but at least if you're thinking of testing it versus shield-type wood, try it against plywood or a much thinner board...
Keith
Posts: 8,310 Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 10:03 pm
Bob;
Well if the blade itself is sound it might be salvaged as a D.I.Y. : Cutting a new and broadly radiused tang and putting a guard & pommel that would work historically with the blade profile and grind type.
Could be any historical period from early iron age to late Renaissance where the funiture style would be compatible with the blade.
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 10:16 pm
Oh, by the way, I have never, nor would I ever, put my "Arms & Armor" or my "Albions" to this kind of abuse nor anywhere remotely near through anything like this. I have far too much respect for these swords and the swordsmiths who made them to even think of doing such a thing! I also have way too much love for my Arms & Armor and Albion swords to ever consider such abuse, the mere thought gives me the "willies"! :eek:
By the way, before trying to split 2 by 6s :lol: , I tried cutting a very large plastic jug of water, the sword is so unwieldy that I only managed to cut 1/3 the way through as it knocked the jug off it's platform. Let's see, I had this sword roughly about 3 hours before I wrecked it! :lol:
Ah well, thar she goes!
Bob
Posts: 8,310 Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 10:31 pm
| Bob Burns wrote: |
Oh, by the way, I have never, nor would I ever, put my "Arms & Armor" or my "Albions" to this kind of abuse nor anywhere remotely near through anything like this. I have far too much respect for these swords and the swordsmiths who made them to even think of doing such a thing! I also have way too much love for my Arms & Armor and Albion swords to ever consider such abuse, the mere thought gives me the "willies"! :eek:
By the way, before trying to split 2 by 6s :lol: , I tried cutting a very large plastic jug of water, the sword is so unwieldy that I only managed to cut 1/3 the way through as it knocked the jug off it's platform. Let's see, I had this sword roughly about 3 hours before I wrecked it! :lol:
Ah well, thar she goes!
Bob |
At least you are taking it well but it can't be much fun. :( On the other hand better to know now than trusting it later and having or causing a bad accident. I assume that you took some precautions just in case the sword should break at the tang or elsewere.
Best wishes.
Jean.
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Thu 05 Oct, 2006 11:14 pm
Yeah Jean, it's a bummer, but that's life, what I did was just plain nuts and I knew it at the time, I played the game and I lost. Now it's a matter of deciding whether to replace it or not, crazy as it may sound it's a strong likelyhood that I will replace it. :lol: But I won't be hacking at wood anymore! :lol: Why would I replace it? Sheer stubborness! :lol:
I can't say I was mad at the time, I was a little sick in the heart and stomach about it with regret at my own crazy behavior and stupidity, but if my posting about it saves others from doing something like this with their new whatever kind of sword, then I have helped another "Knight of the Sword" and that is a good thing!
One thing for sure as of recent months, I've grown so tired of the "me, me, me, me, me," attitude, of which I most certainly have been very guilty of and I am trying to do some things actively to initiate some changes in my life about that.
Maybe part of it is coming up to the big "50" next summer? Anyway, off the thread, but I wanted to share that.
One of the things I really like about "myArmoury" is that we are all here helping one another in our mutual love for something that is very worth while and full of wealth in history!
Some of these swords in the $100.00 to $300.00 range are a very good buy for the money. I still go back to my Towton and Sir William Marshall swords, though the Towton came with a dull edge, I sharpened so that it's like a razor, for what I paid for these swords, they are very nice swords and they cut plastic jugs of water with ferocity!
Don't Cut Wood With Swords :!:
Bob
Posts: 1,019 Location: South Indianapolis IN
Fri 13 Oct, 2006 1:31 am
Well, the decision has been made. Next week I am going over and buying Paul Chen Lowlander Two Handed Greatsword # 2. :lol: Yes I am stubborn sometimes :) but now I have the sense not to strike wood or other solid objects with it. Actually, I have a great mom who moved in with my wife and I a couple of months ago and she felt bad for me and wants to replace it for me. Which I think is very sweet of her. But I was going to buy it anyway as I told her, but she insists.
This being a $100 to $300 for the money sword thread. I gotta say for what I am paying for this sword, and the sheer size of the thing, it's not bad. It's a sword to have some fun with, just not any heavy duty kind of fun. A good workout sword. :lol: Practice
German Longsword moves with it, things like that. Looks pretty cool on the wall too.
Bob
Posts: 8,310 Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
Fri 13 Oct, 2006 8:42 am
| Bob Burns wrote: |
Well, the decision has been made. Next week I am going over and buying Paul Chen Lowlander Two Handed Greatsword # 2. :lol: Yes I am stubborn sometimes :) but now I have the sense not to strike wood or other solid objects with it. Actually, I have a great mom who moved in with my wife and I a couple of months ago and she felt bad for me and wants to replace it for me. Which I think is very sweet of her. But I was going to buy it anyway as I told her, but she insists.
This being a $100 to $300 for the money sword thread. I gotta say for what I am paying for this sword, and the sheer size of the thing, it's not bad. It's a sword to have some fun with, just not any heavy duty kind of fun. A good workout sword. :lol: Practice German Longsword moves with it, things like that. Looks pretty cool on the wall too.
Bob |
With the experience with the first maybe there would be a way to reinforce the tang depending on were it snapped exactly ?
This would depend in part on the ease of taking the handle off and were the weak point is.
With a very " bad " hollow handle construction and the use of a rat tail tang I would use rods of mild steel overlapping the whole length of the tang and wrap with nylon cord epoxying the whole into a solid mass completely filling the hollow handle making the whole assembly into a solid mass. I still wouldn't trust it against even reasonable targets but it would give an extra margin of error against catastrophic failure.
Depending on how this sword is assembled this " fix " mat not apply at all ! I used this to make me feel better about a cheap " Breaveheart " sword with a hollow handle.
Maybe Shane can look over you're broken one and suggest a better way to improve it ? Well, just keeping it as a wallhanger and liking it as a wall hanger is probably the best way to go.
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