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Bob Burns




Location: South Indianapolis IN
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 6:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

While doing some recreational cutting thru 3/4" thick by 3 1/2 inch wide boards on a pallet in my garage the Cold Steel Grosse Messer broke at the rivet area nearest the crossguard. In all fairness there was not one nick in the blade, but what good is a blade if it's tang breaks in the hilt of the sword?

I will not replace this sword!

Bob
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Steve Grisetti




Location: Orlando metro area, Florida, USA
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 6:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bob Burns wrote:
...the Cold Steel Grosse Messer broke at the rivet area nearest the crossguard....

Eek! No injuries, I hope Exclamation

Bob Burns wrote:
While doing some recreational cutting thru 3/4" thick by 3 1/2 inch wide boards on a pallet in my garage....

I've not looked into Cold Steel, so I don't know what their claims are. Also, I don't know how much of this sort of cutting you were doing with the piece, but it seems like a pretty high stress test. A break in the tang at the rivet nearest the cross guard makes sense to me, since that is where I would expect the point of highest stress to be.

"...dismount thy tuck, be yare in thy preparation, for thy assailant is quick, skilful, and deadly."
- Sir Toby Belch
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Jonathon Janusz





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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 6:38 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

. . . at least it took more than a pumpkin. . . Laughing Out Loud
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Bob Burns




Location: South Indianapolis IN
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 6:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nah, no injuries, not even close! I was just disappointed that the sword broke. Thinking about it, in my opinion, that's a pretty stupid place to put a rivet hole, it's about 1 3/4 inches in from the crossguard and would only serve to weaken the tang which it obviously did. Too bad, because otherwise the sword performed very well, as I said there was not so much as a nick in the blade.
All I was doing were cutting motions, there was no prying or other kind of abuse done to the sword, just cutting into some wood boards on a pallet which are pine boards and not a hardwood. What it demonstrates to me is that this Cold Steel Grosse Messer is profiled as a "battle ready" sword, but we all know what that means. Yet, while used in what would have been normal cutting strokes in a battle caused the sword to break 1 3/4 inches inside the hilt. This tells me that if it were used in actual battle, this sword might break on the warrior upon impact into the opponents shield, so now what does the warrior do with a sword handle? Laughing Out Loud
This is not a test that I did to any of my other swords, the Grosse Messer was the sole selection for this kind of cutting, given that it is kind of like an axe in a sword. Too bad about the tang, because otherwise this was an excellent sword for the money. The area where the cutting was done was the sweet spot of the sword and the edge is in near pristine condition. To look at the blade you would not be able to tell it had been hacking thru wood.

Sincerely,

Bob
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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 7:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bob;

Too bad but maybe you can use the blade for a home project ? Create a tang by slimming the last few inches of the blade but not weaken the new tang with a hole anywhere near the guard. Maybe drill a hole closer to the middle and mount it like a Japanese Katana or leave a wider section at the pommel end and cut a two piece wooden handle that can't slide off because of the wider section. Maybe epoxy the handle on and cover it with cord and leather.

Stylistically you should decide on what type of blade you could make from it: Shorter Falcion to a Naginata maybe.

Just salvage something good from the disappointment.

One story of a broken sword is a Hummmmmm Worried Two of the same model breaking is a big ugly red flag Worried Evil WTF?!

Would need a lot of convincing that any other of the same model are safe to use.

I don't think the cutting medium was excessive even if more challenging than cardboard: Now if you were cutting into a foot thick tree trunk sword damage or self-destruction would be almost a certainty.

Well, at least the blade didn't fly off into a neighbour' s yard or bounce back at you: Glad you are safe Bob. Big Grin

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Sam Barris




Location: San Diego, California
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 9:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bob Burns wrote:
This tells me that if it were used in actual battle, this sword might break on the warrior upon impact into the opponents shield, so now what does the warrior do with a sword handle? Laughing Out Loud


Throw it at the other guy's face and run like hell. Laughing Out Loud

Sorry to hear about your sword. I remember you being quite pleased with it. On the bright side, you hear horror stories about this happening where the blade flies back and takes out an eye or skewers someone's arm, so any one you can walk away from, right?

It sounds like you were cutting pieces of soft hobby wood, so I wouldn't expect that to break a blade, but Lloyd's was slain by a mere pumpkin, and his didn't break right at the hilt, so I suspect there are other issues besides the location of the rivet hole. Sloppy heat treatment, perhaps.

Anyway, glad you escaped uninjured.

Pax,
Sam Barris

"Any nation that draws too great a distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools." —Thucydides
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Sun 09 Apr, 2006 11:51 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

You can't say we didn't warn you before you bought it Happy Wink

I'd see if Cold Steel would replace it. They're bound to respond to you, at least, even if without the answer you'd want.

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Bob Burns




Location: South Indianapolis IN
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PostPosted: Mon 10 Apr, 2006 2:27 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thank you Sam very much so for your kind remarks. Jean, you must be reading my mind! Nathan, absolutely! Yes indeed I was warned, I just could not resist the $169.00 price tag. Actually, I am going to contact Ryan over at Kult of Athena to see about him taking a look at it to validate the criteria in regard to the breakage and that it shows no signs of abuse, prior to contacting Cold Steel, in order to see about Cold Steel replacing this sword for me. Very good advice Nathan, and your advice as well as other members prior to my purchase was both correct and thoughtful of you and I do very much appreciate that advice. I have some really good friends here at myArmoury and Nathan you are among those who are at the top of that list, as are Sam, Jean, Steve Grisselli, Stephen Hand, Christian Tobler, Craig Johnson, MAC, Chad Arnow, and many more. I appreciate all of you very much for your guidance in helping me learn!


With a Robust Sword Salute of my German Bastard Sword to All of You!

Bob
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Mon 10 Apr, 2006 2:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I hope you get the results you're seeking. Please let us know what the outcome is. Thanks, Bob.
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Bob Burns




Location: South Indianapolis IN
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PostPosted: Thu 13 Apr, 2006 8:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I wrote three or four emails to "Cold Steel" informing them on what happened to my Cold Steel Grosse Messer Sword, a couple of them were sent on April 10. So far, "Cold Steel" has not so much as even taken the time to respond, which tells me the customer that they simply do not care.

I have their dvds in which they demonstrate all they're swords and make their very out spoken challenge to other sword companies by stating that no other sword company will do these very rough tests of their "battle ready" swords. In fact in my opinion they are none too polite to other sword companies in making their challenge to other sword companies to make the claims that they make of their swords by demonstrating on their dvds just how tough and efficient their swords are.
I have dealt with some of these other sword companies and have related my concerns and or questions to them and each and every one of these sword companies responded to my concerns and questions in a very timely and polite manner, and in each instance they did whatever it took to gain my satisfaction.

In light of the fact that my Cold Steel Grosse Messer broke in half at the rivet point proximal to the crossguard in the hilt of the sword while making normal cutting motions into a pine wood 3/4" thick by 3 1/2" wide and nothing wreckless or abusive was done to the sword. That I promptly and politely notified "Cold Steel" by email and have received no response from them concerning this matter. Tells me that they simply do not care and in my opinion from what has been demonstrated to me by the lack of any reply from Cold Steel, that they are not a company that can be relied upon to be professional enough to be concerned with customer service or customer satisfaction and in view of this, I certainly would never again so much as consider purchasing any Cold Steel product! In fact, you could not give me one of their swords.

Too bad, because I was impressed with the fact that there was not so much as a nick in the blade of the sword in question and up until this situation I thought their products were a good value for their price range.

I remember some months ago, a member posted pictures of their Cold Steel Grosse Messer of which had broken in half in the blade while attempting to cut a pumpkin and I came forward in a post and defended Cold Steel in regard to the Grosse Messer.

Well about all I can say is, that it will be a cold day in Hell when I buy another Cold Steel product in light of all this, besides I did not at all care for their attitude and demeaner in their video in how they addressed other sword companies.

Life is a constant learning process, and I have learned something in relation to all this and it is a lesson I will not forget.

Sincerely and a Word to the Wise to My Fellow Members,

Bob
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Russ Ellis
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PostPosted: Thu 13 Apr, 2006 8:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Their email communication is and always has been spotty, I would suggest calling them on the phone. People in the knife world have had far better results going that route.

As for their in your face sort of advertising, they've caught rather a lot of flak for that over the years.
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Thu 13 Apr, 2006 12:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

April 10th was only three days ago. That isn't a very long time to expect a response. I'd also call customer support rather than relying on email.
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Skyler R.




Location: US
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PostPosted: Thu 13 Apr, 2006 5:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have tried emailing Cold Steel about questions regarding some of their products and not once have they ever responded to me. I just ended up buying from another company. I have called them with my questions before and they did answer all of them, so I am guessing its just their email.
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Thu 13 Apr, 2006 6:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bob;

I can understand your feelings but I would go the extra, way extra mile, of calling as Nathan has suggested just for the satisfaction of being able to say that you gave them every chance to at least answer your complaint. Even if they don't offer any compensation or accept that their sword had a flaw you should at least expect a respectful reply to a polite question.

If they are rude then. Evil

Even those I consider my most reliable vendors ( Friends even ) have been occasionally a bit irregular in replying promptly to E-Mails.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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