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Bryce Felperin
Location: San Jose, CA Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 552
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 Posted: Mon 06 Mar, 2006 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Having read all the posts on this subject I would just like to pipe up with a few comments of my own.
I put down a deposit on the Munich, and knowing full well that it would be probably half a year before it even got sent out, I have no problem waiting. The sword is going straight to someone to make a scabbard for it, then it will come back to me sometime late this year or next. No problem at all. I knew this project was going to be taking quite awhile and I have no problem waiting till it is complete to get an excellent sword and scabbard that will be the envy of everyone of my friends. 
However, I still get that itch for something new...so I might order another sword for the interim. ;-)
The reason for the price increases, as everything else in resources in our world, is increasing demand from China and the far east for those emerging economies. So if you got complaints about things going up such as Gas or Steel, then take it up with your Congresscritters because all Albion is doing is adapting to the prevailing conditions of the global economy. Personally I thought their price increases kind of mild considering that this is the first significant increase I've seen in the year and a half I've been drooling over their site. So I really have no problem with their new prices.
As far as the benefactor program...well that was their own unique method of coming up with more interested customers to invest in their company. Personally, it holds little interest for me due to the low volume of purchases I do (one sword a year or less) but others with extremely large purchases a year might be interested in it. I'm sure if they show a really drool heavy, gem of a benefactor sword on their site they might get more interest in their program. As is right now it's vapor ware and so can't really be taken seriously by me.
Finally, over this weekend I happened to talk to the owner of a small furniture company. He said he has invested hundreds of thousands in equipment to make himself more competitive and use less labor in his manufacturing, but he still figures that within ten years he'll be out of business due to competition from Chinese manufacturing. The same can easily happen to Albion and other US sword makers. Quite possibly in the near future the only people who will be left making these fine production swords will be companies like Windlass or CAS Iberia. Then you'll have to pay at least three grand to get a custom made sword from renowned maker...and wait perhaps three years to get it too! So I figure it's best to support companies like Albion now rather than have regrets because they are no longer in business.
So I stay quit your bitching, save your money up and buy more swords!!!
Bryce Felperin
Member of the Autonomous Collective
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Steve Grisetti
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| Posted: Tue 07 Mar, 2006 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Edward Hitchens wrote: | ...So why the big fuss of Albion's price increase?
Is it because some models saw a higher margin of increase than others? Is it because of the delays in production? Our mixed emotions of their Benefactor's Society? |
My take on the issue, for what it's worth (i.e., the typical "2 cents"), is that the concern tends to be more with the delays in production, and with the Benefactor's Society. Albion's practice of announcing new models prior to actual production has done a lot to create "buzz", and feed demand for their products. The downside is that this practice has also created a sense of anticipation that results in some disappointment when those long anticipated events are delayed. I haven't seen this practice with other sword suppliers, and such delays haven't become an issue, because we don't even know about it.
I think that the Benefactor's Society concept may have backfired by fueling (in combination with the delays), as Jean put it: | Jean Thibodeau wrote: | | ...mostly self-interested concern for their long term viability.... |
"...dismount thy tuck, be yare in thy preparation, for thy assailant is quick, skilful, and deadly."
- Sir Toby Belch
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Kenton Spaulding
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| Posted: Tue 07 Mar, 2006 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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Just an update for anybody who hasn't noticed: The individual pages are up on Albion's website for the Tyrolean and Maximilian, prices look very reasonable. Lower than I might have imagined.
Kenton
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Edward Hitchens
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| Posted: Wed 08 Mar, 2006 7:58 am Post subject: |
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| Kenton Spaulding wrote: | Just an update for anybody who hasn't noticed: The individual pages are up on Albion's website for the Tyrolean and Maximilian, prices look very reasonable. Lower than I might have imagined.
Kenton |
Same for the Oakeshott and the Chevalier, as I noticed yesterday.
"The whole art of government consists in the art of being honest." Thomas Jefferson
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 6:16 am Post subject: |
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| Edward Hitchens wrote: | Just out of curiosity... 
Albion's price increase has obviously caused quite a stir, otherwise this topic wouldn't be taking up 4 pages (and counting). Other swordmakers have increased their prices from time to time and we say "D'oh!" and not make a big fuss of it. So why the big fuss of Albion's price increase?
Is it because some models saw a higher margin of increase than others? Is it because of the delays in production? Our mixed emotions of their Benefactor's Society? |
All of those, I think, and because we care. I like Albion swords very much, more than those of any other similar makers, and seeing them drift away from my reach, however slowly, hurts. No matter how justified - for lack of a better word - the increase is, it's still a grievously disappointing setback for a collector on a budget (like Your's Truly). Especially since, with most of their models, it's now gone past the point where having a sword custom-made by a local smith is, in fact, considerably cheaper for me...
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Chad Arnow
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| Edward Hitchens wrote: | Just out of curiosity...
Albion's price increase has obviously caused quite a stir, otherwise this topic wouldn't be taking up 4 pages (and counting). Other swordmakers have increased their prices from time to time and we say "D'oh!" and not make a big fuss of it. So why the big fuss of Albion's price increase?
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Good question. I think it's a combination of factors:
1) People's wish lists are growing faster than their budgets due to the plethora of models onthe drawing board and in production
2) Some people felt Albion's "old" prices were already pushing the envelope
3) Continued delays on some models has led to general frustration by some as have delays on items already in production
4) The benefactor's society seems to have struck a negative chord
As you noted, others have raised prices with little to no ballyhoo: A&A, Del Tin, Gus Trim etc. Of course, their prices increases have been done with only a little fanfare (A&A, AT) or no (Del Tin) fanfare at all. Perhaps the lengthy buildup to the actual posting of the prices contributed to the backlash. I do think the fact that their intitial prices were already high makes the increase feel more acute. A Del Tin going from $350 to $400 (for example) or an A&A going from $600 to $680 seems to hurt the wallet less than an Albion going from $950 to $1100 as happened with the Regent (granted, many models did not see that drastic a price increase). I don't doubt that the cost of labour has increased as has the cost of raw materials. But in the price range they deal in, every increase seems to hurt even more; I think that's the biggest factor for many. But for many, the old prices were already barely achievable; the news ones cross boundaries many people are unwilling to cross.
ChadA
http://chadarnow.com/
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Chad Arnow
myArmoury Team
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 10:23 am Post subject: |
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In thinking more about this, I had another thought that may have prompted some of this backlash: perceptions about the company.
I tend to think of A&A, Del Tin, and Gus Trim swords as "small" shops. When they raise their prices, people back them more because they each have the "feeling" of a small company, and everyone loves the underdog or the "little guys." Albion "seems" to be a larger company with a more agressive business plan, more staff, and slicker technology. This perception may have little to do with reality (it's a perception after all).
It's hard to compare this effect to anything else. Perhaps this anaology: if West Coast Choppers raised its prices, would people groan as much as if Harley Davidson did? Of course, custom choppers could cost more than a stock bike, but perhaps this is less about money/price/cost and more about perceptions of the company and their place in the market. Harley, with their big company and slick technology, should be able to control and spread out costs more effectivley than a small shop, right?
Just random thoughts....
ChadA
http://chadarnow.com/
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Kenton Spaulding
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 10:59 am Post subject: |
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| Chad Arnow wrote: |
1) People's wish lists are growing faster than their budgets due to the plethora of models onthe drawing board and in production |
I think this could very well be part of it. It isn't something I've really considered before, but I think I would agree. Take Arms & Armor for example. There are quite a few A & A pieces that I have on my wish list, but only one sword, the English Longsword, which I belive is $640. The rest of my wish list is comprised of lower cost items i.e. rondel, danish war axe, etc. Looking at that wish list I am not overwhelmed by any individual prices, although added up it is a substantial sum. This isn't the case when I look at Albion's website. With such a wide variety of swords, all $600 dollars or above, it is tough not to be overwhelmed. Scrolling down through the Next Gen models, there are only a few that I wouldn't be interested in acquiring if I had the means. It makes prioritizing difficult. Do I want a single handed sword or a bastard sword? Ok, single handed, well there are 31 (not including the Roman swords, which I consider somewhat a type unto themselves) 23 currently in production. Makes narrowing it down difficult. No matter which of those 23 I choose there is still going to be another that I say "ok, I'm getting you later." Then I remember that my next sword was suppose to be a bastard and I've got to go through it all again. It just comes down to having a ton of nice models, which I think is a great thing, even though it makes choosing difficult. I think it is good to just take things one step at a time, and not mortgage the farm. Any swords at all are luxuries, be they Deepeka or Templ or Vince Evens, not necessities , and Albion's are the best quality production pieces. Of course they are going to be expensive. Also bear in mind they operate in the US, and strive to use US products. I'm sure that adds up, but I think it is noble of them. Now, my only hope is that enough people can still afford these luxuries to keep them in business. Speaking personally, last week my car insurance went from $136 a month to $195 dollars a month! Either I need to switch companies or I will never see another sword on my shelf.
Good luck with your collections,
Kenton
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Addison C. de Lisle
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 11:44 am Post subject: |
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Is that insurance companies or sword companies that your switching? 
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Kenton Spaulding
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| Posted: Mon 13 Mar, 2006 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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Definitely insurance! 
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