Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Historical authenticity of modern day reproductions Reply to topic
This is a Spotlight Topic Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3 
Author Message
Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin


myArmoury Admin

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep, 2005 1:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This topic has been promoted into a Spotlight Topic.
.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Sam Barris




Location: San Diego, California
Joined: 29 Apr 2004
Likes: 4 pages

Posts: 622

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep, 2005 3:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeroen Zuiderwijk wrote:
Exactly. We can't improve swords, because their function is lost. So we don't know what makes a better sword. We can guess, but never be sure.


Yeah, that's part of what I was trying to get at. Without an earnest trial by fire, how can we actually know whether or not our designs would give a warrior an advantage, or even survive the shock of battle? There's just so much we still don't know about that age, about the way our ancestors fought and about what characteristics they would have cherished in a weapon. I can't help thinking on some level that the true evolution of the sword as a weapon was frozen when it stopped being used as a weapon. It's a wonderful thought for an idle Sunday afternoon to try and take what we perceive as the best characteristics of various swords and then blending them to give us what we consider to be a good range of capabilities, then creating it out of modern materials that are quantifiably stronger. I wanted to do that, many years ago. My kit was going to include an almost unbreakable sword and even a titanium hauberk, which I wanted dearly to make with my own hands. But in the end... why give myself the bother? As a project for an idle summer vacation? Sounds like a great plan! To make me more formidable in ancient forms of combat? Not so much.

I'm not trying to imply that there is no place for modern concept designs and performance-oriented swords that clearly depart from the historical record. On the contrary, those are often very impressive. But I think it's important to know which is which, and not pretend it is otherwise. One of the swords on my wish list is a katana from Bugei which, although it is very traditional in terms of the folding process and the fittings used, has a blade forged from modern powdered steel. I have no qualms about this as long as I steer clear of the two extremes of self-deceit, the first being that my shiny modern uberswerd can cleave mighty boulders without break or blemish and the second being that I'm doing it just the way the Samurai did. On both of those paths lies danger.

Of course, if we start looking at swords as an art form, all bets are off. But if we consider them as weapons, then I must come down on the side of truth. Or at least that tiny glimmer of it we can occasionally perceive, when we're lucky.

Pax,
Sam Barris

"Any nation that draws too great a distinction between its scholars and its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting done by fools." —Thucydides
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
Derek M





Joined: 09 Apr 2005

Posts: 6

PostPosted: Thu 13 Oct, 2005 7:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Patrick Fitzmartin wrote:
Greetings All, Okay maybe I missed this angle in the posts but who are we "handing" the sword to? A seasoned warrior, a person of royal stature or a man of the line lucky to get whatever he could. Each of these individuals would have a different "criteria" for the sword. One may judge for looks, another for response and handling, another just plain tickled at having it. I am going on a limb here but I don't like any of them would realize whether it was "period" or not simply because they would not be aware of that "concept". I really feel they would judge it on "looks" and "performance" based on their station and what they would have to do with it to survive and succeed. Sincerely, Patrick Fitzmartin


I agree and just to add : If I handed any one a weapon from today to a medieval any one via time machine or going back or whaever , by it existing in that time it is period. and only a trained eye would even examine it. If it performed excellently it might be looked into , if it was OK it probably would be just accepted, if poorly it would be tossed as junk,all contingent on users survival. We have the advantage by going there ,they would have no concept of time travel.

So the right person may be able to rate the quality in use and an expert craftsman MIGHT see and try to understand the metal and your secrets but back then they all had their secrets and cloely guarded them. Ours would simply be taken as such.
View user's profile Send private message
Scott Woodruff





Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Likes: 8 pages

Posts: 605

PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr, 2012 7:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I do not have a lot to add, but I'll throw in my two cents. I really think that a medieval warrior would pick up an Albion and immediately appreciate it as a particularly well made sword. He probably wouldn't be more than vaguely aware of the differences, if he cared at all. And the first time he really hit something or someone hard with it, he would say " definitely a keeper!" Medieval people were nothing if not pragmatic (think the great depression generation times 20) and a professional warrior looked at a sword as a tool first and foremost, the same way I might look at a chainsaw, axe or climbing gear (I am a tree-trimmer.) Looking at subtleties of form, strandiness of the steel etc would be furthest from his mind. A medieval craftsman, however, would probably have a very different view. He would probably be very keen on learning all he could about it, but once again from a completely practical standpoint: he would see dollar signs!
View user's profile Send private message
Jojo Zerach





Joined: 26 Dec 2009

Posts: 288

PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr, 2012 8:23 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Scott Woodruff wrote:
I do not have a lot to add, but I'll throw in my two cents. I really think that a medieval warrior would pick up an Albion and immediately appreciate it as a particularly well made sword. He probably wouldn't be more than vaguely aware of the differences, if he cared at all. And the first time he really hit something or someone hard with it, he would say " definitely a keeper!" Medieval people were nothing if not pragmatic (think the great depression generation times 20) and a professional warrior looked at a sword as a tool first and foremost, the same way I might look at a chainsaw, axe or climbing gear (I am a tree-trimmer.) Looking at subtleties of form, strandiness of the steel etc would be furthest from his mind. A medieval craftsman, however, would probably have a very different view. He would probably be very keen on learning all he could about it, but once again from a completely practical standpoint: he would see dollar signs!


I wouldn't agree that everything was always viewed as 100% utilitarian.
Even before the "Renaissance" a lot of medieval weapons and armour were highly decorated.
View user's profile Send private message
Scott Woodruff





Joined: 30 Nov 2005
Likes: 8 pages

Posts: 605

PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr, 2012 8:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Of course. I said first and foremost, not only. I am sure our hypothetical medieval warrior would love his Albion all the more if it were decked out with rhinestones and had a florescent orange and green grip and scabbard!
View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Historical authenticity of modern day reproductions
Page 3 of 3 Reply to topic
Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3 All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2019 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum