Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > short spear, 15th century Reply to topic
This is a standard topic  
Author Message
Guillaume Vauthier




Location: France
Joined: 16 Jun 2016

Posts: 115

PostPosted: Sat 17 Jun, 2017 5:49 am    Post subject: short spear, 15th century         Reply with quote

Reading my Viollet-le-Duc Encyclopédie Médiévale (arms and armors part, of course), I found this picture of a sort of short spear head dating from the 15th century. Looking at the weapon, we can guess than this was designed for thrusting, so couldn't help but draw a parallel with the spear part in the Fiore de'i Liberi Flower of Battle. Such a spear could be pretty efficient against a fully plate-armored opponent.

Here is the picture!

I found various appellations for such a weapon: in Viollet-le-Duc's Encyclopédie it is called a darde, but I found also some other terms like demylance (half-lance) or archegaie or derivatives (arzegaye, arcegaye aso.), that certainely originally came from assegai.

So I plan to order, in the future, such a spear head... but looking at the cross-section of the head, it looks wider than thick. I would like to see a face picture of this, to complete the stuff.

Does someone know what and where could be the actual weapon that was used here by Viollet-le-Duc? Or maybe some similar examples?
View user's profile Send private message
Timo Nieminen




Location: Brisbane, Australia
Joined: 08 May 2009
Likes: 1 page
Reading list: 1 book

Posts: 1,459

PostPosted: Sat 17 Jun, 2017 3:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

It looks like a lance head, or boarding pike head, or possibly a pike head. Not many repro lance heads out there, and it looks like most of them are hollow triangular in cross-section. It isn't a common style of repro. Maybe pike heads would be the easiest to find? Maybe even javelin heads.

(The modern "assegai" probably comes from "arzegaye" or similar, which in turn come from Arabic.)

"In addition to being efficient, all pole arms were quite nice to look at." - Cherney Berg, A hideous history of weapons, Collier 1963.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Iagoba Ferreira





Joined: 15 Sep 2008

Posts: 116

PostPosted: Mon 19 Jun, 2017 8:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

"Azagaya" is the Spanish name of throwing spears Wink . Many more names were used, "dardo" if it had feathers, "javalina", " azcona"... And it's hard today to know the differences between them.

I don't recall ever seeing any point like that, but spears with "diamond" tips appear in inventories and documents of the XVth century.
View user's profile Send private message
Guillaume Vauthier




Location: France
Joined: 16 Jun 2016

Posts: 115

PostPosted: Mon 19 Jun, 2017 8:20 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks both of you for your answers. Happy
Yes, the term "arzegaie" probably came from spanish, that came from arabic, that came from berber. The long words history!

According to the Fiore treatises, I will try to use that design to draw a sort of short lance (about 6/6,5 feet long, or one toise de l'écritoire), highly specialized in thrusting for armored fight. I'll probably use the same general design, adding some longer langets. But I would be more comfortable if someone did see somewhere a sort of historical similar weapon!
View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > short spear, 15th century
Page 1 of 1 Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2017 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum