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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 12:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well Patric, "Cyanyde Gas" !!!! Isn't that what they use in the "Gass Chamber" . GULP.........Good thing we can joke about it!

As they say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing! And I am glad that you seem to be O.K.

No, SERIOUSLY, now I am worried and I am looking forward to reading your next post. (Any post!).

I don't know how dangerous this was, but not knowing is the point. I guess, that before playing with chemicals one must be sure and know exactly what safety precautions to take!

This whole thing seems as safe as juggling half a dozen cocked single action revolvers while drunk standing in a canoe.

Best wishes and take care.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Lee O'Hagan




Location: Northamptonshire,England
Joined: 30 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 5:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

James,
I think i've been trying out the same stuff as your using,
although it's labelled brick acid/patio cleaner over here,
A fingernail depth etch in two to four hours,pretty clean too,
crud and crap removal you can watch it work,
Patrick,
Glad to hear you survived without any undue damage,
the brick acid is slow but sounds so much healthier/safer all round,
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 6:25 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gabriel Stevens wrote:
Patrick, I've been using muriatic acid on galvanized steel for about six months now on some art projects a couple of things you should know if you don't already...muriatic acid will rust steel in hours (which is what I've been using it for primarily) so keep your guard up, with water the effect is enhanced. Second, and maybe not such a big concern since this might be a one time thing, the gas and vapour that apparently burns off of the steel, I've been told, is cyanide.


Indeed. You won't believe how much oil I doused the thing with. It's still going to need a little tumbling in the sand bucket.
If I should have occasion to do this again I'm definetly getting the gas mask out of the trunk of my patrol car! Eek!

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Steve Grisetti




Location: Orlando metro area, Florida, USA
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 8:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Like many Floridians, I have a swimming pool. We add muriatic acid to maintain pH of the pool water in the optimum range. Yes, this is nasty stuff, dilute hydrocholoric acid, I think. After breathing all of those fumes for so many years, it is no wonder that we have trouble understanding instructions in the voting booth.
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B. Fulton





Joined: 28 Dec 2004

Posts: 180

PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 9:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Interesting...

I've been looking for riveted maille, 16 gauge for SCA use (i don't like butted, I want the real thing).

$300 for a decent riveted byrnie is too good to pass up. Although the zinc thing wouldn't do it for me, I'll look up Historic Enterprises.
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 4:29 pm    Post subject: What a Maille mess!!!!!!!!!!!!         Reply with quote

So far I've has quite an experience with the new maille byrnie I purchased from Wholesalearmor.com. This has definitely been an educational and at times frustrating experience, but I believe I have it done now.

I checked the shirt this morning (because of the muriatic acid experience from the night before). Even though I had doused it pretty good with oil there were several large patchs of light rust on the shirt. I was being *dragged* out for a day of shopping by my wife so I didn't have time to mess with it this morning. I told my wife that I was going to have to clean it when I got home. She commented that one of her romance novels mentioned using oil and sand to clean maille. (This is a point who's importance will become clear later on.) I scoffed at her romance novel trivia and off we went.

I wondered around town thinking about something I could use to neutralize the rust. I considered filling a bucket with something and simply soaking the byrnie for a few hours, but what to use? I'd already had my Haz-Mat experience last night so I wasn't up for another chemical spill. I finally settled on vegetable oil. At least it isn't a carcinogen, nor will it burn my lungs out or dissolve my skin, so what the heck? I bought three gallons of oil and went to work as soon as I got home.

I tumbled the shirt around in the sand for awhile without much of a result. I then dumped the oil in a bucket and threw the shirt in. I repeatedly dunked the shirt in the oil for about fifteen minutes. As I was doing this I glanced over at my box of sand and had an idea. I took the dripping shirt out of the bucket and threw it in the sand. In short order I had a disgusting oil and sand paste that I proceeded to slosh the shirt around in. For about twenty minutes I alternated between scrubbing the shirt in that nasty mess and dunking it in the oil bucket. Scrub and dunk. Scrub and dunk. I'm glad I have a six foot privacy fence around my yard. Otherwise my neighbors would have wondered about my leisure activities.

After the last dunk in the bucket I checked the shirt and it was nice and clean! Damn those romance novels. Mad I had to call my wife out into the back yard just so she could gloat. If this was anything like the authentic cleaning methods I can see why they had squires to do this sort of thing.

After all this hassle I now have a maille byrnie that is the desired color. I also have a box full of goo too. Laughing Out Loud

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus


Last edited by Patrick Kelly on Tue 28 Dec, 2004 4:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 4:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Patrick, this has been one of the funniest stories to follow around here in a long, long time.
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 4:57 pm    Post subject: Re: What a Maille mess!!!!!!!!!!!!         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:
After the last dunk in the bucket I checked the shirt and it was nice and clean! Damn those romance novels. Mad I had to call my wife out into the back yard just so she could gloat. If this was anything like the authentic cleaning methods I can see why they had squires to do this sort of thing.

Look, I really hate to say this but... did Fabio have anything to do with this new technique of yours, Patrick?

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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 4:58 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
Patrick, this has been one of the funniest stories to follow around here in a long, long time.


I figured everyone would get a good laugh out of my experience. Big Grin

I need to buy more of these cheap projects. I'm not afraid to fool around with them. Consequently I always learn something.

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 5:01 pm    Post subject: Re: What a Maille mess!!!!!!!!!!!!         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
Patrick Kelly wrote:
After the last dunk in the bucket I checked the shirt and it was nice and clean! Damn those romance novels. Mad I had to call my wife out into the back yard just so she could gloat. If this was anything like the authentic cleaning methods I can see why they had squires to do this sort of thing.

Look, I really hate to say this but... did Fabio have anything to do with this new technique of yours, Patrick?


I don't think so. It was probably some guy with a name like Sir Dirk Hardmember, or Lord Lance Longshaft or something.

We went on vacation once and my wife took along a lot of those books on audio tape to listen to. The Kelly men were getting pretty embarssed while driving down the Interstate!

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 5:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Again, this makes me glad that I don't really mind about the color of galvenized steel.

So, do you have to do that sand/oil thing often to keep the rust away?......LOL.

Patrick glad you are still alive: Have you told your wife yet about the possible level of risk you took, I would imagine that you would see an unprecedented level of "rolling of eyes"!

Oh, if you do use your gass mask to do this again make sure that it is rated to protect against cyanide gass.

Also the diluted type used for cement sounds much safer: I assume you used the stuff at maximum strenght?

Sorry for the teasing, can't resist!

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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B. Fulton





Joined: 28 Dec 2004

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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 5:25 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As far as I remember, the sand method was what was done in the old days.



Helping a female friend in her 20s (I think she was right at about 20 at the time) move, she got three of us guys with trucks, and her dad's minivan, with two more girls to help move (females, as you all know, have far more in a small apartment than a guy in the same apartment usually). One of the boxes had a romance novel desert and fall to the floor.

My friend Brandon, who is hard to embarass, out of "curiousity" picked it up, randomly flipped open and started reading in a rather loud voice....... he just happened to flip to a major love scene.

The female friend in question nearly died of embarassment, and all the guys had a good laugh.
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Gordon Clark




Location: Purcellville, VA
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 5:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Patrick,
That was really fun.

Let us know when you are ready to sell the darn thing - since you have done all the work, I would be inerested Happy
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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Tue 28 Dec, 2004 6:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Quote:
Patrick glad you are still alive: Have you told your wife yet about the possible level of risk you took, I would imagine that you would see an unprecedented level of "rolling of eyes"!


Oh yes she knows, and yes, there was!

Quote:
I assume you used the stuff at maximum strenght?


Well of course I did!

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Steve Grisetti




Location: Orlando metro area, Florida, USA
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PostPosted: Wed 29 Dec, 2004 6:10 am    Post subject: Re: What a Maille mess!!!!!!!!!!!!         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:
...I finally settled on vegetable oil...


Umm. You may have some more hilarious stories...once that vegetable oil goes rancid. Perhaps mineral oil next time?
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Ben Sweet




Location: 831
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

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PostPosted: Thu 30 Dec, 2004 4:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here are 3 pics that Pattie sent me


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Patrick Kelly




Location: Wichita, Kansas
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PostPosted: Thu 30 Dec, 2004 8:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for posting those Ben! Compare the above photos to the shirt's original finish.


"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Ben Sweet




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PostPosted: Thu 30 Dec, 2004 8:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Patrick Kelly wrote:
Thanks for posting those Ben! Compare the above photos to the shirt's original finish.


No problem Patrick...now ya just gotta send the a pic with you wearing the maille so we can see how it hangs Laughing Out Loud
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Jeff Johnson





Joined: 05 Jan 2004

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PostPosted: Mon 03 Jan, 2005 4:12 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Looks good! Coming in late to the thread, but I have I've stripped zinc from mail before & here are some observations:

- Muriatic acid is Monochloride Hydrochloric Acid. I believe the gas by-product is primarily (flammable) hydrogen, but you ought never take chances with anything with a chlorine component.
- You can reduce the strength of the muratic acid reaction by diluting it with water first.
- You can also reduce the rust formation afterwards by spraying the mail with WD-40 immediately after the water rinse. (hot water is a good idea to speed drying, but probably doesn't help too much)
- If you want to darken it a bit more, it may be possible to do so by heating it on a very hot 450-500 degree (closed) gas grill for at least a half hour. If there is oil on it, the oil will blacken. This is useful if you have oiled it enough to have penetrated into the crevases of the rivets & joints, as it will reduce rust formation there, but the oil will wear off on the exposed areas.
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Paul Mortimer




Location: England, Essex
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PostPosted: Mon 03 Jan, 2005 10:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Cheers, Jeff,
I have been trying to darken my mail for some rime. Useful tip. Just a slight problem will my wife notice the smell?


Paul
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