[Mikko Kuusirati]

[Daniel Wallace]

i believe for the most part, that those of us within the forum are pretty responsible owners. i say that because of how many times I've seen a thread that jumps all over the danger of the blade and proper handling.


its inevitable to study blade without also expecting to one day study the trauma they produce. weather by studying evidence like the photo, or test cutting your studying what that sword can and was meant to do. and yes i realize not all swords were meant to be battle swords by bearing swords.


there was a documentary years ago on NOVA (at least i think it was nova this was nearly 10 years back) where a skull of a soldier from the war of the roses was found and reconstructed. using clay and other materials forensic scientist put a face to the man, and in their analysis, scientist found out the man lived through 2 sword wounds, one to the side of the jaw that left him horribly scared, and a second given to him at a later time (if i remember correctly) was an actual skull fracture that was bound and mended. his final wound was from a bill of horseman's hammer to the skull.

while watching it was informative to see the break down of how the wounds were dealt, the fact that this man didn't die from either of his previous wounds without modern antiseptics is pretty amazing.

[Shane Askew]

Thanks, Mikko!

I couldn't easily get hold of my copy of "Hogfather" and had to rely on (imperfect) memory. The quoted bit is much better than I remembered - illustrates the point even more clearly.

Patrick wrote:
"In my opinion, it has little to do with physical experience as much as a chronic lack of critical thinking skills. Something lacking in our society at an ever increasing level. You would think that any reasonably intelligent human being would be able to grasp a weapon, be able to realize it's a dangerous thing and handle it with at least a modicum of caution. This is regardless of any training or lack thereof. "The long part is sharp, I should be careful." "The end with the hole is where the bullets come out, maybe I should point it in a safe direction.""

Yes, Patrick, I think you've nailed it. And Gabriele's example is a great illustration too. You'd think some sense of danger/protection would finally kick in when people's own children are involved. Hair-raising! Could it be that (some) people really DON'T see the danger? That they really ARE that cossetted and insulated and genuinely expect the world to be a "made safe" one. Is this the same thing that leads people to get out of their cars and try to pet a lion or bear?

Changing tack back to the original post:
It is a clean cut, just like a coconut. All the more impressive because, as one of my high-school teachers pointed out: bone, is hard. This is contrary to the way skulls are so easily smashed and chopped and stabbed into in tv progamns such as "The Walking Dead". Real bone is a lot stronger and harder than THAT - thank God. But it's ultimately not invincible. I've seen what a medium sharp blade can do to hard, old wood (roughly comparable to wet bone?) when swung without much effort.
Having said that, in South Africa, where I'm from, we regularly have people turning up in A and E waiting rooms with an axe or panga (machete) stuck in their head. My brother has witnessed this twice, I think. I've personally seen one of the labourers I worked with turn up for work with a deep furrow in his forehead from a blow with a bluntish axe. He had concussion and was off work for a few days, and then had an infection for a while, but otherwise was none the worse for wear (apart from that permanent furrow). The bone did its job.

A clean cut as shown in the original post is testimony to a heavy and very sharp weapon wielded with skill. That picture is a sober reminder of what happens when men hit other men with weapons like that.

[Christopher B Lellis]

[Henrik Granlid]

I personally will probably never own a sharp weapon, or at least not for a very long time. Simply out of respect for the edge and an unease at keeping a three foot razor around. Sometime, in the future, when I can get a proper lockdown on it (and have the money to do so), I might get a sharp Landgraf for test-cutting and possibly for weapon-works displays out with the knights, however, knowing full well how children are around anything shiny (grownup men are children too in this regard), I aim to get a scabbard with some sort of metal locking mechanism so that the sword can be padlocked and not drawn.

Note, I am not saying that people should not own sharp weapons, they are beautiful and highly functional, I'm just saying that I have no true personal use of a sharp due to using my blades for stagefighting and hema.

I think a general problem is that people who have never handled a sharp (or even a blunt) does not understand what swords are capable off. It is not that they have been pampered, it's just that they don't know what to expect. When I draw sword, children flinch back and in their eyes there mingles terror and joy, however, when the swords are on a table, every kid wants to draw it, because it is inert, it is not a "live weapon", even when out of their scabbards, they are percieved as a "dead" sword by parents and children alike, making it seem safe to handle.

We often have a weapons table, displaying helmets, chainmail, pieces of plate, shields and, of course, weapons. All of the weapons however, are blunt, we make note of that and we do let children (again, all ages) handle them. One could argue this both ways, that we are ingraining into them that "swords are safe", but at the same time, they know the weights, they know where they can and cannot hold (Please don't touch the blade, it'll rust) and I believe that getting more familiar with a weapon in a safe way is a good method of preventing accidents should they ever come across a sharp (for some inexplicable reason). Worth noting is also the fact that parents do seem to be slightly more alert because we are standing there, they somehow realise that we are a sort of safety buffert between the kids and the weapons and that they too need to help look them after. Otherwise, we could've just laid it all out on the ground in a big pile and had someone sit idly a couple of feet away rather than two people talking, helping people try out helmets, drawing swords for people to hold etc. It's all about body language and engaging with the children.


TLDR:
People not used to swords go "Oooh, shiny"
Live sword = "Oooh, dangerous", Inert sword = "Me next, me next."
Weapons table = Pros and cons of the same coin, and parents beeing somewhat extra watchful during.

[Jeremy V. Krause]

I tell my 4 year-old daughter that swords were used to fight dragons- including her very own 12th. C. mace repro. made by Leo Todeshini.

At the same time she doesn't have access to any swords, knives, daggers of mine.

[Daniel Wallace]

[Scott Hanson]

[Greg Ballantyne]

I'm not really interested in a sword that isn't sharp. Its true, a sword is weapon that cannot be unloaded, to use a firearm analogy. I also keep a couple of loaded firearms around, but not all of them are kept loaded. I don't have children around the house, nor have children visitors much. My fascination and collecting of weapons is largely based on admiration of functionality, and a large part of functionality is the ability to put the weapon to use. I can't be the kind of collector who keeps unfired Colts in boxes, or blades that have never cut, dull or sharp. But that's just me, I'm not at all suggesting that someone else's preferences are in any way invalid.

[Patrick Kelly]

I remember, many years ago, the first time I cut something sizeable with a sword. The end result didn't surprise me, but what did was the lack of effort it took to achieve that result. In movies the hero will often be seen to muscle his overly large sword around, obviously to demonstrate his strength as a hero. But in reality, a strike like the one shown in the photo wouldn't have been that hard to achieve from the stand point of shear physics. sharp steel should be respected in any form.

[Robert B. Marks]

[David Clark]

Regarding what Patrick has said above, the same issue of little-effort must also be said of spears. I remember the huge shock I had when I stabbed a deer I had hanging to skin with my boar spear. The way it punctured at least three inches with so little force on my behalf frightened me in a way. I didn't even feel resistance. I only just barely stopped before burying the whole blade on accident. It made me appreciate that spears could and were used effectively with quick, short jabs, and not huge cinematic lunges and burly thrusts.

[Daniel Wallace]

years back, i remember a video from what looks like ARMA, there were three bamboo trunks place in front of the welder who used a long sword. they looked like 3 inch in diameter he swung through all three (with quite some effort) in one stroke and cut them to what looked like a nice smooth cut. afterward he took the sword and ran it across his forearm to show that the blade of the sword was totally dull along its edges.

now that caught my attention. a blades geometry is made to maximize its cutting potential, even if there is very little of one there. a sharp will cut deeper than a dull one, but don't be fooled by a dull edge - even though it doesn't feel sharp, the push and pull force applied to a proper cut just multiplies what that edge can do.

[Josh S]

[Dan K. F.]

[Michael Wiethop]

[Lance Morris]

Its a great reminder to all of us in our collecting lives what our hobby can truly do to a person.

we cant shy away to much however, that is in fact what a true sword was used for, killing.
even with added aesthetics.


Just curious, I have almost always tested the sharpness of my new swords. in multiple ways: cutting tamashigiri. slicing paper and this infamous thumb test ( i do it with my finger and very carefully)

Not trying to debate Lay-people handling your swords incorrectly, i'm talking about us.

Hand to god. Does no one else test there personal sword edges by "feeling" the edge?

[Luka Borscak]

[Bryan Heff]

[Daniel Wallace]

i do my best not to thumb test the edge of my blades. for a knife, i usually work the edge down to a 1000 grit stone. once I'm pretty sure i think it's level and even, I'll eye ball it. sometimes if your really off, you can see where that edge is not even with the rest of the it, and you got to go back and work it back a few more times. once I'm satisfied that it is level I'll use a very light cloth, lie it on a decent surface, and drag the blade through it. that edge is sharp enough if it makes a clean cut, if it frays in a few places, then you've got a few flat spots or uneven places where the bevel didn't work over well enough. on longer blades I'll place it in a vice and then try to drag the cloth through the blade instead, when you do this you'll see the places where the blade is cutting, and the spots it may be 'ripping.'

but even if this test result is good, i go back over the edge with a very fine steel/rasp or leather strop. once that blade made contact with a hard surface, you've already begun to dull it. a very sharp edge is very fine, and doesn't last too long. every cut begins to compromise it.

i do not use the paper test, as i can drag a very dull knife though paper and get the same result as a sharp one result.

and if i do happen to thumb test, its always done by raking my thumb across the edge, never along it, or by pressing into it. there is still no better way at finding flaws in your burr unless you rake across the edge.

now personally, i don't believe a sword blade should be honed down to 1000 grit. even 600 is a pretty fine edge, but if you get into these really fine edge, your going to continue to hone it after every use - taking more and more steel away. but this can be different depending on what kind of blade you have on your sword. if there is no secondary bevel on your sword, that edge is going to remain pretty sharp for a cut even if it feels dull, the difference is if your sword has a secondary bevel, then it get a little tricky.