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Alex Cerioli




Location: Italia
Joined: 26 Aug 2013

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PostPosted: Tue 27 Aug, 2013 10:36 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Am I drunk or that Mycenean sword looks familiar?


"Their pacts are their swords, their favour a punishment"
Pope Gregory on the Longobards.
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Matt Corbin




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PostPosted: Thu 29 Aug, 2013 4:41 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Oh snap!! Eric that G2B looks fantastic Cool Absolutely my favorite style of bronze sword. And one that's sadly not reproduced nearly often enough.

Really looking forward to seeing that finished some day Big Grin

“This was the age of heroes, some legendary, some historical . . . the misty borderland of history where fact and legend mingle.”
- R. Ewart Oakeshott
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Matthew Amt




Location: Laurel, MD, USA
Joined: 17 Sep 2003

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PostPosted: Fri 30 Aug, 2013 6:28 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Alex Cerioli wrote:
Am I drunk or that Mycenean sword looks familiar?



Not sure what you're seeing--this reminds me of a Nazi dagger, which I thought was derived from a medieval baselard. There are Bronze Age hilts which vaguely resemble that, but no real connection or kinship between them. It's a shape that gets the job done.

Eric, ditto, that looks smashing! I'd forgotten Neil did that type. I've got one of the old Indian-made Albions, but yours is much nicer. The dark wood sets it off perfectly. Congrats!

Matthew
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Eric Lu





Joined: 22 Dec 2009

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PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 8:15 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for all the comments!

Here are a couple photos of the mycenaean g2b finished up. I added a small piece of bone between the pommel and handle. I also reshaped the horns a bit to better imitate a reference I found of an original sword of this type. This was a fun one to work on, as well as being a good learning experience.



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D. S. Smith




Location: Central CA
Joined: 02 Oct 2011

Posts: 236

PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 8:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Alex Cerioli wrote:
Am I drunk or that Mycenean sword looks familiar?



I realize it's not historical, but that is a gorgeous looking dagger. Easily one of my favorite I've ever seen.
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Tue 29 Oct, 2013 9:19 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

D. S. Smith wrote:
I realize it's not historical, but that is a gorgeous looking dagger. Easily one of my favorite I've ever seen.


Google "Holbein dagger" for historical examples.
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Joe A




Location: Philadelphia, USA
Joined: 17 Oct 2013

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PostPosted: Thu 31 Oct, 2013 10:06 am    Post subject: Just Arrived         Reply with quote

Picture says it all.


 Attachment: 217.28 KB
Myc G Sword.jpg

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William M




Location: Buckinghamshire , England
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PostPosted: Thu 31 Oct, 2013 1:10 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is the original in the British Museum.


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Matt Corbin




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PostPosted: Thu 31 Oct, 2013 9:21 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Joe, that is stunning as well. Did you do the grip yourself or is that from Neil?

William, that is of course the famous Woodhouse Dagger. I only know of one other sword of that type and that is from Elis Greece. Sadly I have not been able to find very much about this one which was originally posted by Kirk Spencer some time ago:
Quote:
Hi all…

While reading through “Polemos: Le Contexte Guerrier En Egee A L’Age du Bronze,” I came upon a very interesting report on some late Bronze Age swords found in Mycanean Tombs in Elis Greece (11th and 10th century). The report is entitled: “Late Bronze Age Swords From Ancient Elis” by Birgitta Eder. Eder publishes photos of two of the swords—One with horns (Type G) and one without (Type F). The author speculates that the limited number of these types of swords is due to the growing popularity of the
Naue II swords developing from central European prototypes. Before too many of these horned Aegean swords could be produced the Naue II type superceded them.

The tombs at Elis are dated to 11th to 10th century B.C.

Here is the Type G2b from Tomb 1963.4
Overall length 46.6 cm/18.3 in.
The inlay of the grip is bone (or, less likely, of Ivory)



 Attachment: 141.37 KB
Type G from Elis Greece tomb 1963.4a.jpg
Type G2b from Elis Greece

 Attachment: 225.21 KB
Type G from Elis Greece tomb 1963.4b.jpg
Type G2b still clutched by its original owner

“This was the age of heroes, some legendary, some historical . . . the misty borderland of history where fact and legend mingle.”
- R. Ewart Oakeshott
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Bjorn Hagstrom




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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 1:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Neil unfortunately do not have a standard offering of my favorite bronze age swords (the slender almost rapier-like ones from the South Scandinavian/North German context)

But another question regarding those of you that have bronze swords: Have you used them for cutting? And if so, how do they compare to other for most of us more familiar sword types?

There is nothing quite as sad as a one man conga-line...
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William M




Location: Buckinghamshire , England
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 1:39 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for the link Matt !
A little morbid but fascinating to see the owner of the sword still clutching his sword in his grave. I can imagine it would had served him very well considering the design would have been a lot more reliable structurally than the majority of the rapiers that were being used.
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Matthew Amt




Location: Laurel, MD, USA
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 6:41 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

William M wrote:
A little morbid but fascinating to see the owner of the sword still clutching his sword in his grave.


"You CAN take it with you!"

Quote:
I can imagine it would had served him very well considering the design would have been a lot more reliable structurally than the majority of the rapiers that were being used.


Nah, the rapiers were all long gone by that time. And if I'm recalling correctly, Barry Molloy's research showed that the Naue II did not by any means replace the indigenous Greek swords, in fact it was never the most common type in Greece. Which is weird, because it does appear to be the direct ancestor of the Archaic and Classical hoplite sword!

Joe and Eric, beautiful swords!! Congrats, and welcome to "The G Men" club, ha!

Matthew
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Joe A




Location: Philadelphia, USA
Joined: 17 Oct 2013

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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 7:08 am    Post subject: Working with Neil         Reply with quote

I am unfortunately very unskilled in most aspects of making anything so I ordered my new G as you see it.

This is my second bronze sword from Neil, first was an excellent NAUE II, and he likes to know what one will use it for before he makes it to ensure the customer is happy. As I use these as teaching tools for kids reading Homer Neil thought olive wood would make an interesting and appropriate wood for the hilt, and it is not sharpened.

Someone mentioned these are harder to make than the other swords on his website and Neil mentioned that as well. Of course the cost reflects that difficulty, but as he includes shipping and a very sturdy mailing/storage tube in the cost I still feel it was a bargain.

Keep in mind this is an almost exact reproduction of a well known artifact and is just 40cm in length. The word "dagger" rather than "sword" may be what most folks associate with something that length.

I am already saving up for my next Neil Burridge bronze sword.
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William M




Location: Buckinghamshire , England
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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 8:18 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hehe Razz Here is Neil himself with all that is precious to him. Booze and bronze.




Last edited by William M on Fri 01 Nov, 2013 9:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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Matt Corbin




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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hahahaha Laughing Out Loud That is awesome William.

The sword in that burial is actually quite a bit longer than the Woodhouse dagger. It would really be nice to see Neil do a replica of that one at some point.

This isn't from Neil, but it is about the nicest G2B recreation I've ever seen: http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=1547

“This was the age of heroes, some legendary, some historical . . . the misty borderland of history where fact and legend mingle.”
- R. Ewart Oakeshott
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Eric Lu





Joined: 22 Dec 2009

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PostPosted: Fri 01 Nov, 2013 4:43 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Awesome references there and great photo of Neil haha. I remember Kirk's thread about his albion g2b sword. He did such a unique job putting that one together!

Also, that's a beautiful sword Joe! Every collection needs a Neil blade Big Grin He's pleasant to deal with and each piece feels like a treasure. I've got the Mycenaean type G (pointy one with the shorter horns) that maybe I'll finish someday. It came with quite a sharp edge on it; I've already been accidentally cut by it during a quick polishing!

There's something really special about bronze blades to me, maybe it's how they instantly bring to mind a very distant world. Neil definitely captures this in his work.





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Michael Sandoval





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PostPosted: Sat 30 Nov, 2013 7:50 am    Post subject: stats         Reply with quote

Thanks for this wonderful discussion--

Still looking for comparative stats on Neil's swords that people own. He does a fair amount of customization, so I'm curious to see the variations. The swords I'd love to check are:

- Witham Antenna sword
- Limehouse
- Ewart Park
- Naue II (late model)

Length, weight, and POB

I'm very interested in people's opinion of the handling of these swords, especially the Witham.

I bought Dan Howard's book, Bronze Age Military Equipment, which gives an excellent overview of weapons and tactics of the Bronze Age of the Near East/Aegean regions. It doesn't deal with Western or Northern Europe (taking nothing away from the book, which states it's scope on the first page). But it goes into great technical detail on subjects ranging from the evolution of chariot warfare to an analysis of early Bronze Age armor

I'm interested in the historical use and ownership of the swords listed above, especially in Western Europe and especially Great Britain. For example, the Witham--a beautiful, continental import--was a high status weapon, no? In which case, it's ownership would've been regulated to those who could afford it: chiefs, nobility...? Was the Ewart Park--a plainer blade, but of excellent handling, as reported by owners and Neil--more a weapon for warriors "on the line," in which case, were these noble or well-off warriors who could otherwise afford the ownership of such weapons?

Thanks for any insight!
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Harry Marinakis




PostPosted: Fri 03 Jan, 2014 5:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Just ordered a Mycenean G2B and a Witham antennae sword. Big Grin

Thinking of using Olivewood burl for the G2B handle.

I've seen someone outfit the G2B with a large bulbous pommel (like those found on Neil's Ewart park swords).

The photo that matt Corbin posted earlier in this thread on Fri 01 Nov, 2013 12:21 am shows a G2B with 4 rivets in the handle. The upper rivet seems to preclude a large bulbous pommel. Seems more consistent with the handle shown in Joe A's post on Thu 31 Oct, 2013 1:06 pm .
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Matthew Amt




Location: Laurel, MD, USA
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PostPosted: Sat 04 Jan, 2014 8:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Just happen to have "Die Schwerter in Griechenland" by Imma Kilian-Dirlmeier on interlibrary loan for a few more days, and it shows a number of Type G swords and similar ones with flanged hilts that have organic parts still in place. And they varied! It looks like most have the pommel no thicker than the grip. But at least a couple have the "bulbous" or mushroom-shaped pommel (done in two halves, of course), with the rivet going through the "stem", where it's much narrower. That's how I did one of my Albions:



Though the other I did flat:



Gotta say, flat is easier! The rivet for the other one is rather long, and the wood is about a 45 degree angle at that point so peening it was a real pain. I think I used glue to keep the wood in place, not trusting the rivet to be tight enough to prevent rattling.

There were also swords with very similar hilts but having only a tab with a rivet hole for the pommel. Those are all variations on the mushroom shape, too.

Matthew
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Harry Marinakis




PostPosted: Mon 21 Apr, 2014 7:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

My Neil Burridge G2B stats
(blank blade without a finished grip)

Total length: 15-7/8" (40 cm)
Blade length: 10-7/8" (27.5 cm)
Blade width: 1-9/16" (4.0 cm) base, 1½" (3.8 cm) mid-shaft
CoG: 1½" from the base of the blade
Weight: 1 pound 1.6 ounces (500 gm)
Handle width (max): 13/16" (2.0 cm)
Pommel width (max): 1½" (6.3 cm)
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