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Stephen Renico




Location: Detroit
Joined: 01 Feb 2009

Posts: 51

PostPosted: Wed 15 Jan, 2014 12:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The low ceilings of most homes would seem to negate the swinging motions of a poleaxe.

Better would be a short spear, or an ahlspiess.

"The state that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards, and its fighting by fools." -Thucydides.
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Daniel Deaconson




Location: Virginia
Joined: 05 Dec 2014

Posts: 1

PostPosted: Fri 06 Feb, 2015 12:24 pm    Post subject: Swinging the axe...         Reply with quote

Worried I'm sort of... well... frustrated at how this conversation keeps returning to the subject of swinging around the polaxe over ones head and the undesirable outlook modern folk have for using such measures as axe-play to defend the home. First of all , the butt-spike of the axe can be used as a weapon, too, and often was a central aspect of it. Second, trying to reflect on how one's own interaction with such a situation as this would play out does not give insight as to how the people of the past, as the influences a modern person has in their mind are of a nature unique to modernity, and would most likely not even be close to what the days of olden were like.
I think most historical martial arts weapons, like the polaxe, are no less effective now than in their heyday: the difference now is that the challenges in modern combat changed, and have exceeded the importance of solving the challenges of, say, knightly duels and the problems associated with them.
However, the nature of a home defense situation, even today, actually does involve a great deal of close confines in which a "hache" could be well worth using, like if a gunman is at the door or something along those lines. Melee could make a profound difference at that point for the defender's benefit.

The Great Big Two-Handed Knightly War-Sword of German Origin
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Kyle Glover





Joined: 12 Dec 2013

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PostPosted: Fri 06 Feb, 2015 6:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

M. Phan wrote:
Outside the context of warfare, how violence was it back then that household would need weapon racks at the front door? Did people normally expect bandits to show up their front door? Or was it because of high level of feuding?


Most definitely feuding in the context of the Paston Letters. The online versions I have found dont have the same letters as my print copy, but at the time of the famous "send crossbows, jacks and pollaxes and also some spices and some fabric to make gowns for the children" letter, their manor at Gresham is about to be seized by their rivals. There are descriptions of servants of various land owners fighting in the streets, some of them wearing armour and carrying swords. Later there would be effectively open warfare between various factions disputing who owns what land, with their castle at Caistor beseiged by possibly several thousand of the Duke of Norfolks men, the walls damaged by gunfire and at least two of the servants killed.

There's a good description and transcription of some of the letters on the BBC website Here towards the bottom of the page under "Loss of the prize".
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Gregg Sobocinski




Location: Michigan
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PostPosted: Fri 06 Feb, 2015 7:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

THANK you, Daniel for bringing this back to my original focus.

I am thinking strictly historical, and I'm thinking of larger, multi generational households or manors of some means, such as nobility or merchants. I'm thinking of having the weapons for outside use to defend the door, but the entry would be a large-enough ante-chamber, designed to welcome guests of status, so that some fighting could be contained there. I thinking of the threat coming from feuds and occasionally gangs hired by rivals, or even small peasant mobs riled by the aforementioned rivals. I'm thinking that the weapons at the door would be for keeping the threat at bay, while others went to the proper armoury, and sent for help from nearby allies.

Thank you Kyle for adding historical context to the Paston letters. This fits the impression I had from the Oakeshott quote, and gives me more historical references to follow.

Thanks also to Neil. I had more time to appreciate reading your post this time around (how did I miss that?), and was very interested in reading historical details regarding the Paston manor, and the disputes surrounding it. Obviously, three or four pole axes were not enough to stop a force of a thousand!
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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
Joined: 11 Jul 2010

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PostPosted: Sat 07 Feb, 2015 3:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

i would also contend that, such larger households and manors woiuld also perhaps provide a defensive focal point in the case of a raid sine they often have a stronger construction and are the residences of the more well to do people and often the most martially trained. in that village area assuming there isnt a castle or fort nearby
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Henrik Granlid




Location: Sweden
Joined: 17 Apr 2012

Posts: 103

PostPosted: Sat 07 Feb, 2015 12:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What makes people believe a sword to be more apt at home defense? Have you looked at your Sword and Buckler plays lately? Have you looked at the langmessers? But certainly the chopping and hacking hammer motions of a hatchet would be small?

You're telling me that you have enough space to accelerate a sword or axe but not enough to generate force with a weapon just as shar?

Slide your hand up and you can now use a pollaxe just as well as you can any one handed weapon, the only difference is that your two handed grip gives you more leverage and a stronger thrusting weapon. Really, a close quarter battle in a tight space will look the same wether you use a sword or a two handed weapon. Except that the two handed weapon gives you a stronger thrust, a better push and an overall more powerful presence.

There is an absolutely beautiful video out there discussing the weapon system of medieval armament. Anything you can do with a pollaxe, you can do with a quarterstaff, a longsword, an arming sword and a dagger. A pollaxe, especially with a shortened handle, would be ideal for home defense in its time, be it inside or outside.
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Pieter B.





Joined: 16 Feb 2014
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PostPosted: Sun 08 Feb, 2015 8:13 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Regarding the placement of weapons in racks or on the wall: Maybe it was not purely intended for home defense but more for showing off. As many said the hall which is present in most medieval houses was the public space. From wills we learn that this room was often decorated with wallcloths and cabinets for displaying metal pots and pans even in the poorest households. It stands to reason that weapon owning people would chose to display weapons they owned or perhaps even used.

I think it's really the "wow factor" folks wanted to achieve by having a weapon or even a sallet displayed in their house.
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Gregg Sobocinski




Location: Michigan
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PostPosted: Sun 08 Feb, 2015 7:50 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I agree that many modern weapons enthusiasts overlook the effectiveness of hafted weapons. I sure did for many years. I think they'd make the best entryway weapons, since they require so much less maintenance than a sword, and they would be better suited for use by servants in an emergency.

I see the possibility for both showing off the weapons, or perhaps for sending the message to visitors that they are in a safe place. The former idea fueled my original inquiry about ornate pollaxes created for entryways more than for tournaments. At this point, I don't expect to find a definitive answer, but the original idea still appeals to me.

The history behind the Paston letters definitely doesn't support this idea as much as I had hoped. Eric W. N.'s post fits with something I thought I remembered seeing either pictured or reproduced somewhere. Regarding the prevalence of violence, I'm sure it would come and go with the politics and stability of rule. Italy sounds like a good place for such weapons racks. Italians also produced some fantastically ornate hafted weapons.
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