help with ID medieval quillon dagger! -- myArmoury.com

Cornelis Tromp

Who can help dating this medieval dagger?
maybe someone knows a similar type sword or dagger.

length 34cm, pommel Oakeshott type G with hollow/concave surfaces 4cm/2.8cm thick, grip 8.4cm, 9.6cm cross, blade 19.6cm

thanks for the help!

Cornelis Tromp · Posted: Sun 15 Jul, 2012 2:17 am Post subject:

only I know of a sword, an excavation from belgium with the same type pommel, with hollowed faces.
see photo.

is there none of the forum who can tell something meaningful about the dagger or it's type?

Neil Melville · Posted: Sun 15 Jul, 2012 6:01 am Post subject:

Hi Cornelis,
sorry I can't help much with the dagger but I do know of an early (14th century) Scots sword which has a concave-faced pommel, in the National Museum of Scotland, no. LA2. Hope this helps.
Neil

Cornelis Tromp · Posted: Mon 16 Jul, 2012 4:01 am Post subject:

Hi Neil,

thanks for the pictures, very interesting because here one would actually expect a "falling rain-drop shaped" wheelpommel as fe the sword on the tomb of Gilbert of Greenlau in Aberdeenshire.

it at least gives a little direction in time, for what it's worth.

Best,
Jasper

Craig Johnson · Industry Professional

Hi Cornelis

Dagger dating out of context is very difficult for several reasons. The biggest issue being that styles where often used for long periods of time. In this case while it could probably be anywhere from 13th C to 15th C, but it would not surprise me if it was late 12th C or possibly even early 16th C. So while the object does not dictate an exact time by style or detail it would be more likely to be something along the lines of 1400 to 1450.

Best
Craig

Cornelis Tromp · Posted: Mon 16 Jul, 2012 1:33 pm Post subject:

Hi Craig,

thank you, yes this would be a possibility. Oakeshott has made a brief comment in tsitaoc P95, pommel type G
'some examples, mostly dating after 1400, have concave faces"
further, I found 3 swords, maybe daggers or maybe swords for children?, with a similar short ricasso;
musée de lármee jpo1189, RA ROMs P227 # 19, glasgow museum ROMs p238 .

1350-1450 sounds plausible.

best,
Jasper