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Mikko Kuusirati
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 Posted: Tue 16 Nov, 2004 4:26 am Post subject: |
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Could it possibly stand for HIV - Heinrich [something beginning with I] the Fifth, or Heinrich the Fourth in case the sword was originally made for an ancestor?
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Kenneth Enroth
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| Posted: Tue 16 Nov, 2004 6:19 am Post subject: |
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In "Records" number XIV.5 is inscribed "TOTOTO". on the pommel. It's meant as an affirmation of loyalty and fidelity.
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Patrik Erik Lars Lindblom
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| Posted: Wed 17 Nov, 2004 10:44 am Post subject: |
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There are a statue of Heinrich, in Marienberg, west of Dresden.
My basic octoberfest German can not translate this. 
Herzog Heinrich der Fromme von Sachsen
Auf dem Marktplatz erinnert das Denkmal an den Gründer der Stadt.
Das überlebensgrosse Bronzestandbild wurde 1900 eingeweiht.
Herzog Heinrich war Regent der Ämter Freiberg und Wolkenstein.
1519 erliess er Schürfrechte auf diesem Territorium.
Es entstand ein gewisser Wohlstand und Beschäftigung für viele im Bergbau.
In dessen Folge wurde 1521 die Stadt Marienberg gegründet.
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Allen W
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| Posted: Wed 17 Nov, 2004 11:15 am Post subject: |
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I find it interesting that he is shown wearing a bastard sword as a sidearm while wielding a two-handed sword. I would expect that hilt to get in the way while employing the two-hander.
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Elling Polden
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| Posted: Sun 21 Nov, 2004 6:47 am Post subject: |
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there is actually a picture of a similar blade in the Album section....
Stumbled across it ant thought of this thread, though it's been dead for a while.
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/photo/1727.html
Yours
Elling
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Sun 21 Nov, 2004 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Elling Polden wrote: | there is actually a picture of a similar blade in the Album section....
Stumbled across it ant thought of this thread, though it's been dead for a while.
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/photo/1727.html
Yours
Elling |
 What IS that thing? A genuine historical piece? Bearing sword? Wacky replica? 
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin
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| Posted: Sun 21 Nov, 2004 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Mikko Kuusirati wrote: | | What IS that thing? A genuine historical piece? Bearing sword? Wacky replica? |
I'm not sure that I would agree with Elling that these swords are similar. I think the only common thing is that they have wide blades, though the one discussed throughout this topic isn't anywhere near as wide as the looks of the strange two-handed bearing sword in the photo albums. I think that particular sword has been discussed before on the various forums and it was thought to be a processional sword, in that the proportions are just so extreme. The overall length is 49" with a 6.6" wide blade. It's Italian and dates from 1500.
.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Sun 21 Nov, 2004 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| Nathan Robinson wrote: | | I'm not sure that I would agree with Elling that these swords are similar. I think the only common thing is that they have wide blades, though the one discussed throughout this topic isn't anywhere near as wide as the looks of the strange two-handed bearing sword in the photo albums. I think that particular sword has been discussed before on the various forums and it was thought to be a processional sword, in that the proportions are just so extreme. The overall length is 49" with a 6.6" wide blade. It's Italian and dates from 1500. |
Ah... How much does it weigh, anyway?
I would agree that the vaguely similar blade profile is about the only thing connecting these two. While Heinrich's sword is still within the limits of feasibility, I think, this one looks outright ridiculous as a functional weapon.
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Wolfgang Armbruster
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| Posted: Tue 08 Nov, 2005 7:13 am Post subject: |
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Hello,
I'm sorry to have "resurrected" this old thread, but are there any news on this one?
Is Peter Johnson still planning to make a recreation of this sword?
This is truly one of the most beautiful and at the same time strangest bastard-swords I've ever seen.
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Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Tue 08 Nov, 2005 7:45 am Post subject: |
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| Wolfgang Armbruster wrote: | Hello,
I'm sorry to have "resurrected" this old thread, but are there any news on this one?
Is Peter Johnson still planning to make a recreation of this sword?
This is truly one of the most beautiful and at the same time strangest bastard-swords I've ever seen. |
I am absolutely going to make something inspired by this sword.
I hope to bring along one or two longswords to the knifemaker show in Solingen next year, late april. This might be one candidate (but there are others on the really-want-to-do list as well). We shall see.
It is not unusual that it takes more thasn one year to go from first seed of an idea to completed sword. That is why I prefer working on available-now basis, rather than accepting comissions: it is very difficult to plan worktime, having a growing family and design comissions to fit in with regular swordmaking in the smithy.
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Wolfgang Armbruster
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| Posted: Tue 08 Nov, 2005 8:20 am Post subject: |
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| Peter Johnsson wrote: | | Wolfgang Armbruster wrote: | Hello,
I'm sorry to have "resurrected" this old thread, but are there any news on this one?
Is Peter Johnson still planning to make a recreation of this sword?
This is truly one of the most beautiful and at the same time strangest bastard-swords I've ever seen. |
I am absolutely going to make something inspired by this sword.
I hope to bring along one or two longswords to the knifemaker show in Solingen next year, late april. This might be one candidate (but there are others on the really-want-to-do list as well). We shall see.
It is not unusual that it takes more thasn one year to go from first seed of an idea to completed sword. That is why I prefer working on available-now basis, rather than accepting comissions: it is very difficult to plan worktime, having a growing family and design comissions to fit in with regular swordmaking in the smithy. |
Thank you! That's good to hear, Mr. Johnson
I'm the last person on earth trying to put pressure on an artist 
Maybe I'll make it to Solingen but the chances are quite low due to my time-shedule (seems like everybody has the same problems  )
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Steve Grisetti
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| Posted: Tue 08 Nov, 2005 4:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Wolfgang Armbruster wrote: | Hello,
I'm sorry to have "resurrected" this old thread... |
Don't be sorry, at all, Wolfgang. I must have missed this thread last year, and very much enjoyed reading it!
"...dismount thy tuck, be yare in thy preparation, for thy assailant is quick, skilful, and deadly."
- Sir Toby Belch
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Hank Reinhardt
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Thu 10 Nov, 2005 1:11 pm Post subject: mystery sword |
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Its simply a kaltzbalger with a long blade. Normally these blades are somewhat short, but I have seen them with long blades. Executioner's blade were all wide, with rather short blades, and no point at all. Its hard to tell if its a Victorian copy from the photograph, but I would doubt it. Most Vickies were made close to originals so as to be easier to sell. The other sword is a two hander. These real wide bladed two handers were popular in Sweden, Norway, Denmark and North Germany. The hilt and the figure eight guard really give it away. Hank Reinhardt
Hank Reinhardt
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Russ Ellis
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Thu 10 Nov, 2005 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Peter Johnsson wrote: | Good morning!
Thanks guys
While I´ve been sleeping you´ve found all I need to know to be able to proceed. Now it is just a matter of making a pilgrimage to Dresden. I need to study this sword closer.
Perhaps I can even get to document it carefully.
We´ll see.
Dresden seems to be a nice place with all thses art museums and historical relics of high interest. Never been there before.
I need to make a sword like this.
Just look at that scabbard!
The lenght (blade and total) and weight are quite similar to the sword of Svante Nilsson Sture, btw.
Thanks again! |
Missed this thread the first time around, I'm glad it came back... I am looking at that scabbard Peter... now I just need someone to be willing to foot the bill for it...
TRITONWORKS Custom Scabbards
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Eric Meulemans
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Thu 10 Nov, 2005 1:57 pm Post subject: |
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I will be in Dresden sometime early next month, and a visit to this museum certainly seems in order. Shall I attempt to take more photos of this piece or inquire there as to further details?
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Wolfgang Armbruster
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| Posted: Thu 10 Nov, 2005 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Eric Meulemans wrote: |
I will be in Dresden sometime early next month, and a visit to this museum certainly seems in order. Shall I attempt to take more photos of this piece or inquire there as to further details? |
You have to ask?!?!
Of course! Please do so! I think everybody would like to see better pictures of this beauty . Especially ones that show the cross-section (must be quite thin with such a wide blade) are appreciated
Thx for this offer btw.
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Bob Burns
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| Posted: Sat 12 Nov, 2005 10:41 am Post subject: |
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A custom German / Italian bastard sword for a very huge man? Obviously, I would have no idea but thank you for posting this, it sure is interesting to me.
Thanks,
Bob
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Sean Flynt
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| Posted: Wed 11 Apr, 2007 11:44 am Post subject: |
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I want to ressurect this thread and stir the pot a bit. I wonder if the shorter overall measure of ~105 cm (see earlier post by Peter) could be the correct one after all. Consider that the Wallace Collection's A477, a German hand-and-a-half sword of the same period and with some of the same characteristics, is around 96 cm overall. The Windlass/MRL reproduction of that weapon is slightly longer at ~99cm. Consider the repro of A477 alongside Heinrich's sword and pretend that the latter is a total of maybe 10 cm longer. In this light the total overall length of 105 cm seems pretty reasonable.
So, maybe the Windlass weapon could serve as a platform for a Heinrich conversion project
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-Sean
Author of the Little Hammer novel
https://www.amazon.com/Little-Hammer-Sean-Flynt/dp/B08XN7HZ82/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=little+hammer+book&qid=1627482034&sr=8-1
Last edited by Sean Flynt on Thu 12 Apr, 2007 7:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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Joel Whitmore
Location: Simmesport, LA Joined: 25 Aug 2003
Posts: 342
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| Posted: Wed 11 Apr, 2007 7:49 pm Post subject: Thanks Sean |
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...for bringing this thread back to the surface. Did Peter ever get to document or measure the original? How did they get along? Will Peter make a reproduction? I can't stand the wait to see what happened! I can't believe this thread was that old. Peter!!
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Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Wed 11 Apr, 2007 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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This sword is like an itch I can´t reach.
Unfortunately there has been no opportunity to travel to this part of Germany yet. I still hope to do so, as another important sword has surfaced that would be good to get a closer look at.
This sword has inspired an interest in broad thin blades. It is one of the main reasons I did the sword for the Macao exhibition that way I did, even if it is not directly based on the Dresden one. One of the swords brought to Solingen last year was also a child of these ideas even if it came out as a unusually broad XVIIIc. There are other broad thin bladed swords in various forms of dream state preparation. Perhaps one or two of them will come to fruitition?
I would love to add a broad type XXII to the Albion NG line at some point.
-First a trip to Dresden is on the whish list however...
Another spin of is a study of very broad and very thin single hand swords. There is one probable XIa in Uppsala (broken halfway down, so it is not possible to know for cetain its type) that is impossibly broad but also quite thin. It is a brute in size, but still handy. This one has me rivetted: a faschinating blade.
Single hand XXII blades can also be also very nice. There is something about the design solution of these that push the boundary of what is possible with edge geometry, stiffness and agility.
One sword in storage in Solingen is a very broad *single edged* hand and a half sword that is extremely thin. The hilt might be a 19th C composite, but I have a feeling it could actually be original. A strange sword but faschinating just because of that.
All this is perhap a bit OT, but this is how it works for me: you see one sword that stands out from the crowd, looking unique and perhaps even impossible. Then other swords pop up that shares some of the same qualities and design solutions. At this point they will start to haunt you: the only way to be free is to make a practical study of some sort.
I still really want to do something based on the Dresden sword and it would be nice base it on some observations of the original. It is possible to guess of course, but it is more fun to have some known data as set limits.
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This is a standard topic