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Nathan Quarantillo




Location: Eastern Panhandle WV, USA
Joined: 14 Aug 2009

Posts: 279

PostPosted: Mon 04 Jun, 2012 8:45 pm    Post subject: Re: The Many Varieties of Zombification         Reply with quote

Michael Parker wrote:
Nathan, your parting strike is a "scheitelhau". Happy

The "perfect anti-zombie weapon" debate is always pretty hairy just because people don't agree on the characteristics of zombies. "Classic" zombies shamble around slowly and infect you by biting you. Of course, whether the plague is a bacteria, virus, or a magical curse depends on whose story you are referencing. We get our zombie legends from African voodoo and bo traditions, but clearly a lot has been lost or changed in translation. Lately, so-called "fast zombies" have become a lot more fashionable, such as in the movie of 'I am Legend" and the videogame "Left 4 Dead" (though in "I am Legend", the zombies share characteristics with vampires such as hatred of sunlight, while I hear the book was about vampires). One crucial difference is whether zombies are defined as "the undead" or more loosely as the "infected". In those versions the zombies aren't so much shambling rotting corpses as they are grotesquely infected and rabid people, who run at you at top speed trying to turn you or eat your flesh. The whole "aim for the head" thing also varies with what source you like best. Max Brooks' "World War Z" and "Sean of the Dead" with Simon Pegg are more traditional in insisting the zombies will keep getting up unless you remove the head or destroy the brain. Max Brooks explains this by showing how zombies' bodily fluids become more viscous and their brain stops relying on the body for nourishment, so that even if you cut one in half the zombie will not bleed to death and its top half will stay alive. It's even scarier if you imagine that zombies can hibernate or survive for long periods without food. However, Left 4 Dead just throws that out and says that if you shoot or dismember them enough then they will bleed to death, even if the head stays on.

The method of infection is important too. If your infection transmits only by being bitten you have some leeway, but if it is by coming in contact with zombie fluids then you have to avoid physical contact at all costs and close range fighting is likely to get you infected even if you survive combat. On the other hand if the virus is depicted as airborne and especially if it were capable of being carried by vectors other than humans then you might have a hard time not getting infected anyway. If you're still around when everyone else has been turned into zombies it might mean you're immune to the airborne form, bite-transmitted form, or both, in which case risking a few scratches in melee combat might be a viable option. Which of these rules apply would basically determine whether you stand a chance in close combat.

A quick survey of our monsters shows that zombie is in fact a very flexible term for all manner of flesh eating rabid human creatures, who are so different from each other that they are probably suffering from very different diseases or curses. It's all up to the author's imagination and there is no right or wrong way to do it. Regular human cannibals, of course, can be dispatched with the sword since the sword is designed to kill people, but in order to determine what weapons are fit to kill zombies we need to specify which zombies we are trying to fight.


Thank you Mr. Parker. I had it's name mixed up with a schilhau (I'm sooo butchering these spellings! Razz ) and I really didn't want to accidentally advise someone to try to use one of those on a target's head. Wink I personally go by the Max Brooks standard. He to me gives the most comprehensive study of the zombie as we know it.

BTW, my melee weapons are a short pollaxe and a falchion/messer. Or maybe my warhammer.

"Id rather be historically accurate than politically correct"
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Julian Reynolds




Location: United Kingdom
Joined: 30 Mar 2008

Posts: 271

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 3:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This is what I would grab from my arsenal:

Sorted.



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Julian Reynolds




Location: United Kingdom
Joined: 30 Mar 2008

Posts: 271

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 3:08 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

And as many rounds of this shotgun ammo as I could make/carry:


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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
Joined: 11 Jul 2010

Posts: 1,523

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 8:49 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

im going with a cut down wallace collection poleaxe i.e axeblade plus hammer on the back,

axeblades have the issue of getting stuck, flanged and knobbed maces/ toothed hammerheads have much less chance of getting stuck. but having the axeblade makes it more viable as a tool in a general sense.

but if sombies were to start walking TOMORROW id be in not such a good situaion,

i curently have a reenactment blunted norman sword. a oak quarterstaff, a 30 lb bow With 10 target arows, and a cold steel kukri machete which is a nasty cutting tool but pretty short..
plus a pair of sai..

currently my daneaxe isnt with me although thats blunted as well. but if sharpened, id be using the daneaxe as my primary.


personally i like the crowbar idea, it doubles as a tool and is nastily effective. otherwise id just grab a 5 foot long piece of iron rebar from the garage, and put on my welding glove gauntlets and gambeson... the latter two prevent easy scraches.

as for the max brooks zombie one thing to consider is that with viscous blood, it cant move.. since the muscles NEED APT (adenosine triphosphate) to undergo muscle contractions and they use them up VERY fast, and need constant resupply by the blood., so the rabies driven running zombie is more likely in theory.

but the slow zombies are easuier to kill,

and as for the flamthrower.. remember, the onlythign worse than a horse of flesh eating zombies are flesh eating zombies that are on FIRE.

id also question the effectiveness of a phalanx on zombies that feel no pain, and spearheads would get stuck pretty fast,
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Paul B.G




Location: Victoria, Australia
Joined: 01 May 2011
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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 12:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

For me it's either going to be a falchion or a katana, cut and slash all the way Happy
A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person

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Tho’ much is taken, much abides; and tho’
We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven; that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.

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Greg Ballantyne




Location: Maryland USA
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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 5:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

.357 ammo is comparatively small and light - I'll take my Marlin 1894 Cowboy, Ruger Blackhawk revolver for a sidearm, and a handy one hander Viking blade for when the ammo runs out. You all have to remember, there simply ain't no surviving a Zombie Apocolypse, so its all how far you get and the style you employ, cause no one gets out alive
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Robin Smith




Location: Louisiana
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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 5:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Greg Ballantyne wrote:
.357 ammo is comparatively small and light - I'll take my Marlin 1894 Cowboy, Ruger Blackhawk revolver for a sidearm, and a handy one hander Viking blade for when the ammo runs out. You all have to remember, there simply ain't no surviving a Zombie Apocolypse, so its all how far you get and the style you employ, cause no one gets out alive

On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero. Wink

A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 5:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have a large stockpile of .22LR, 5.56mm, 9mm, and 12ga along with ammunition for my primary weapon platforms. I keep other calibers around, but those are my Apocalypse weapons.

My favorite go-to weapon is my new ATF approved 7.5" AR SBR:



Backup weapon would simply be another AR out of the safe or one of my eight 9mm Glocks (one which is with me at all times anyway).

No way I would peg my life on a sword when I have a diversity of firearms around to keep zombies at least a few feet away while dispatching them. If I ran out of ammo, I'd use a baseball bat to deal with a zombie before I'd reach for one of my blades to mitigate the risk of splattering blood-borne pathogens all over myself or my family.

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Neil Langley




Location: Stockport, UK
Joined: 23 Jan 2006

Posts: 112

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 5:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If it's style you want, a snooker cue is the way to go! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnTR-cG5W1I

Neil
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Andrew M.





Joined: 16 May 2011

Posts: 15

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 7:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

@sarge

DO WANT

Going with the Left 4 dead version of zombies, they don't seem to notice gunshots. However, as the virus is actually a virus, and most of the survivors either have biohazard protection from the military or are immune, melee weapons would be a useful choice for immune people. Otherwise, there's no worry about it. I'm not really familiar with classic zombies.
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Robin Smith




Location: Louisiana
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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 7:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

JE Sarge wrote:
I have a large stockpile of .22LR, 5.56mm, 9mm, and 12ga along with ammunition for my primary weapon platforms. I keep other calibers around, but those are my Apocalypse weapons.

My favorite go-to weapon is my new ATF approved 7.5" AR SBR:



Backup weapon would simply be another AR out of the safe or one of my eight 9mm Glocks (one which is with me at all times anyway).

No way I would peg my life on a sword when I have a diversity of firearms around to keep zombies at least a few feet away while dispatching them. If I ran out of ammo, I'd use a baseball bat to deal with a zombie before I'd reach for one of my blades to mitigate the risk of splattering blood-borne pathogens all over myself or my family.

Nice!

I don't have an SBR, but I do have a Colt 6920 as my primary should John's mustache get too long.



That one is no longer wearing the Aimpoint C3 and now wears an Aimpoint T1, with the C3 having migrated to a backup AR.

A furore Normannorum libera nos, Domine
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Roderick Stacey




Location: Ballarat, Australia
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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 7:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

A Cricket Bat!



Last edited by Roderick Stacey on Wed 06 Jun, 2012 6:05 am; edited 1 time in total
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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
Joined: 11 Jul 2010

Posts: 1,523

PostPosted: Tue 05 Jun, 2012 11:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

thin bladed european swords like type X viking blades in my view are a bad choice,

their thin blades work for humans because they can slice with ease and make deep sheering slices, but when getting to the head and neck region theres a SERIOUS risk of drag.. and of them getting stuck completely...


and sarge, while id agree, range is always better,

for really close encounters, i think we can agree a blade IS neccesary, one wih power preferably, so.. id maybe reccomend a scottish backsord.. why that sword? because scotish broadswords often have a layer of padding between the hand and the basket, meaning theres less chance of your hand being scratched and infected,
(and hey.. it worked for mad jack churchill)
http://www.museumreplicas.com/p-284-scottish-cutlass.aspx
i consider the ability to be able to punch at things to kep things away to be of fair importance when things go sour.

to that end id include maybe a diamondish shaped talhoffer buckler, not for any fancy maneuvers, but just something to punch things with without infection risks. if needed. and i mean im no expert in marching with lots of gear, but a buckler looks like it takes up VERY little room and weighs very little

another weapon max brooks noted to be good in the thick of things is the trench knife with knuckle duster. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Model1917_knuckle_duster.jpg
that would have no problem puncturing a skull with an icepick grip stab. and no matter what type of zombie were facing a spike hrough the eye will kill.

but of course as most military personnel have told me.. if hes gotten that close.. you've already massively screwed up..

also..
most people note the anti zombie effectiveness of shotguns but note he risk of being that clos, and also note the limitaions of rifles like the WW1 issue lee enfield rifle in close quarters... to both of those id add a bayonet..
a bayonet means that your much better prepared for sudden attacks, say when reloading. a bayonet means you dont have to transition from ranged to melee weapons,


but to go for all out craziness, when you absolutely definately have to kill every last damn zombie in sight...
http://download.xbox.com/content/images/66acd...enlg15.jpg you need this..
oh and also making lightsabres out of maglite flashlights and gemstones is pretty cool.
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Lafayette C Curtis




Location: Indonesia
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PostPosted: Thu 07 Jun, 2012 1:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

JE Sarge wrote:
If I ran out of ammo, I'd use a baseball bat to deal with a zombie before I'd reach for one of my blades to mitigate the risk of splattering blood-borne pathogens all over myself or my family.


But a baseball bat would cause a large quantity of medium-velocity spatter anyway!
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Greg Ballantyne




Location: Maryland USA
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PostPosted: Thu 07 Jun, 2012 5:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I forgot about the light saber...... but then again I don't have one.....
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Roberto Banfi




Location: Near Milan - Italy
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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jun, 2012 4:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I definitely want a bunch of you guys to my side if such an apocalypse occurrs Big Grin

lots of interesting ideas, however I'm gonna keep it easy

I think my motto would be: "use anything that comes at hand until you find something better"

even Richard Gales' favorite

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VDvgL58h_Y
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Fri 08 Jun, 2012 5:23 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Lafayette C Curtis wrote:
JE Sarge wrote:
If I ran out of ammo, I'd use a baseball bat to deal with a zombie before I'd reach for one of my blades to mitigate the risk of splattering blood-borne pathogens all over myself or my family.


But a baseball bat would cause a large quantity of medium-velocity spatter anyway!


Anytime you kill something in a melee, there is a chance of spatter. It's just a matter if you want a little or alot. Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Steve Shimmer




Location: Wickford, England
Joined: 03 Jun 2012

Posts: 14

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jun, 2012 6:58 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

My new flanged mace would be handy, no need to worry about it being sharp, less splatter than you'd get from some other weapons and small enough to not get in the way when you're running through post apocalyptic buildings trying to avoid the hordes of undead!

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Greg Ballantyne




Location: Maryland USA
Joined: 14 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jun, 2012 7:34 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Perhaps it's possible to think too deeply when it. ones to some subjects - but I cannot rationize a zombie with a heartbeat. No heartbeat, no blood pressure, blood pools in low spots, etc..... not much in the way of splatter is likely.
Bash and Slash away!!!!
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William P




Location: Sydney, Australia
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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jun, 2012 8:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

this assuming they are truely undead..

in dead rising 2 (he game where you can make awsome weapons,) they are infected, not undead, they are the victms of mind controlling parasites, (such parasites exist just not for humans as hosts and yes these parasites can influence the thing to go in a paicular direction/ swich off certain hormones, say, pain sensory organs or the part of the brain which says 'don eat other humans' . ..), so they can be killed by normal means.
and they are mostly the slow shuffling type, although they will sometimes run shrt distances, but mostly just lunge at you..

the function of biting people could be be able to feed/ spread the eggs of the animal whoes inhabiting the human. or allow fresh hosts for th insects eggs.

this theory is PLAUSIBLE about as much as the rabies virus one is except we HAVE the rabies virus and we DONT have such parasitic animals in nature, not yet anyway.

as for blood splater, if you cave in a skull, you wont get much splatter,
as for flanged mace, max brooks noted that, a clw hammer can probably do everything a mace can do as a weapon, but i can also hammer nails, pry things open etc..

but for sheer destructive power i think id go with a mac that had a topspike of sorts.
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