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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Mon 04 Jul, 2011 9:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Edelson wrote:
Why do you collect swords if you don't train to use them, and why don't you train to use them if you have them?


There are a number of threads about what things drive people's collecting habits that touch one this in one way or another. Here are some:

A Question of Why -- For enthusiasts and W. Martial Artists
What do you do with your swords?
Are you an Academic or Practitioner?
a few fun questions for the forum Happy
What do you guys do with your swords?

There are so many reasons people collect and many of them have nothing to do with training with swords. Happy How a sword is used is not the only interesting thing about it. Laughing Out Loud

Happy

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Joe Fults




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PostPosted: Mon 04 Jul, 2011 9:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Edelson wrote:
This thread brings up a question...and please, I do not mean to offend anyone, but I am very curious.

Why do you collect swords if you don't train to use them, and why don't you train to use them if you have them?


Once upon a time I did train with them (a little)...now due to some medical considerations I don't have the option of training with them anymore. Perhaps it represents longing for a simpler time. Worried

"The goal shouldn’t be to avoid being evil; it should be to actively do good." - Danah Boyd
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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jul, 2011 1:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nathan Robinson wrote:
By the way, nobody commented on my awesome topic title!


OK, I get it now. 'Fan' of swords is not Nathan, its the 'Fan' of swords in the picture. Ding Ding.

Guess sword fans are not the sharpest tools in the shed. (Now I'm talking about human Fans, I think).
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Stephen Curtin




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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jul, 2011 1:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

J.D. Crawford wrote:
Nathan Robinson wrote:
By the way, nobody commented on my awesome topic title!


OK, I get it now. 'Fan' of swords is not Nathan, its the 'Fan' of swords in the picture. Ding Ding.

Guess sword fans are not the sharpest tools in the shed. (Now I'm talking about human Fans, I think).


Wow I can't believe we all miss that, guess we're all a little on the blunt side.

Éirinn go Brách
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Andrea Scattolin




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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jul, 2011 3:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have to disagree with Marcus,that sid,that reproduction swords has no value.
I personally collect custom repro swords rom some of the best makers,nd,i swimply do not even like old vintae swords,has,my idea,is,to try to feel as close as possible,to the people o these ages,i do not even want any patina old finishing on mine,i like to feel as i amsuppose in 17th century,and i buy ,after discussing with my favourites swordmakers,the weapo,and,i handle i like to feel as they felt,for what it is possible.
I personlly,prefer collecting pintins,if i want something to be hanhed at my wlls,and i did.
Then,i really donot think noen here is fishing or compliment.I personally have some 40 pieces between swords and daggers,all 18-17th century,a lot of clothins,various types of buff coats,boots,breast plates,ecc.,and,i never sent a picture to the forum.I might do it,when i will feel to,maybe,i do not know the people in here well,but,i am glad,this forum exist,it is a great company and historic font for me,s itry reading a lot bout historical warfare and politics.History it is repeting itself,and can be a ood lesson for the future,as it is for today.
Best
Andrea Scattolin
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Bryce Felperin




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PostPosted: Tue 05 Jul, 2011 4:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

After reading this topic's replies I have little to add...but I will say that my interest is old and from childhood for swords and their "romance" value (in terms of a deep interest and longing for learning from the past). My first reason for collecting was curiosity, then a desire to own one, then a desire to handle and become proficient in use of them. I train on long swords weekly and have done so for eight years and I will continue doing so until my health keeps me from doing so in my old age.

I have probably bought and owned a dozen swords of various types so far, but own only two trainers and three sharps now. Early on I decided that I would keep my collection simple and small so I have sold off or given away the rest over the years. Now I am at the point where I will probably not be buying many more unless a really good example becomes available, or it's a custom order to my specifications and needs exclusively, in which case it will never be re-sold.

The problem as I see it is whether you put a lot of emotional commitment, time, money or labor into obtaining the sword, or any hobby item. The simple answer is that if you didn't, if it was just a matter of putting in an order, getting it delivered, playing with it for a short period and then putting it into storage, then you don't really have a commitment to it. I have only two sharps I really can call myself invested in, emotionally or financially. The rest are replaceable. If I need to dispose of them then I can, with no qualms emotionally anymore. I have already thought ahead to the items I need to sell, give away or donate to others if I need to and so I am able to do so if the need to do so occurs. I'm sure Nathan will come to the conclusion of what is important to him and what isn't. It's just a matter of personal perspective really.

What we should all remember though is that collecting is a hobby, not a necessity. Life changes over time and yesterday's desires become tomorrow's garage sales.
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Thomas R.




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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jul, 2011 1:13 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bryce Felperin wrote:

What we should all remember though is that collecting is a hobby, not a necessity. Life changes over time and yesterday's desires become tomorrow's garage sales.


There's some truth in it.

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Gottfried P. Doerler




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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jul, 2011 8:25 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Andrea Scattolin wrote:
I personally have some 40 pieces between swords and daggers,all 18-17th century,a lot of clothins,various types of buff coats,boots,breast plates,ecc.,and,i never sent a picture to the forum.I might do it,when i will feel to,maybe

please share with us Big Grin
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Andrea Scattolin




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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jul, 2011 1:37 pm    Post subject: sword fan         Reply with quote

I am so sorry,but i have to ask some friends,in order to help me to take pics.,as i do not have a camera,and,i am a disaster with it,computers,and,pratically,with all technology
I will try.Most weapons are Cervenka,from Cech republic..I also have to correct.My weapons are 16-17th century.
Andrea
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Matthew P. Adams




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PostPosted: Wed 06 Jul, 2011 3:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I would suggest not looking at which swords will increase in value, or which swords are similar to others, but instead at which swords bring joy into your life.

Whenever I try to cut down on clutter in my house I look at things that are "to good to get rid of" or " was a great deal" and I don't want to get rid of any of it. But when I come to the dilemma asking which items are currently, actively bringing happiness into my life, the question is suddenly an easy one.

Best of luck separating the wheat from the chaff.
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Sean Flynt




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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul, 2011 12:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What every happens to Nathan's collection, this thread inspired me to go ahead and sell some of mine after many weeks of wondering "if" and "what". Big Grin I sell most everything that comes through my hands and regret almost none of the sales/trades. For me, this hobby is about learning. I buy/trade/make a piece, learn what I can from it and pass it on, keeping the knowledge but not the object.
-Sean

Author of the Little Hammer novel

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T. Arndt




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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul, 2011 2:36 pm    Post subject: Nathan's Dilemma         Reply with quote

Hey Nathan,

First off, beautiful collection! I'm a fan of your fan- Happy

After reading everyone's posts I was reflecting on how I might proceed if I was in your shoes. This is just my 2 cents, so feel free to disregard.

1. Every 3 months choose the sword in your entire collection you are most able to part with. (Or less or more time- however much time is necessary to make the choice)

2. Have an auction on this site (or ebay with a post here) with the understanding it is a fundraiser. At fund raising auctions people often knowingly exceed the market value with the intent of supporting an organisation or person.

The way I see it this would allow you to harness this wonderful community to help financially support the operation of this site and help you reduce your collection.

Another possible idea would be, excluding the items you never want to part with, allow everyone to have a running bid on the other items in your collection. When you feel the bid / ownership ratio is right for a particular piece you could choose to part with it. This would allow you to know at any time the monetary value of liquidating part of your collection. This idea would probably entail a bit a programming for a web front-end / database back-end however-

I hope my brainstorming helps! Good luck! Eek!
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Robert Brandt




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PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul, 2011 3:56 pm    Post subject: Fan of Swords         Reply with quote

Here are a few general thoughts on sword collecting that this thread has brought to mind.

Nathan asked who else out there is struggling with letting go? I believe most of us collectors go through phases where the hobby consumes more or less of our lives. For me that has manifested in slower periods of acquisition rather than large scale reductions. I have known others who for economic reasons, relationship reasons, or changes of interest have drastically reduced or completely eliminated collections. But for most of them, the reasons for that were apparent.

My first thought is to challenge Nathan's opening contention. I hope to give no offense, but do you really NEED your collection to shrink considerably? Your reasons would not compel me to sell. You say "this stuff is valuable" and "it takes up a lot of room." But you don't say, I can't afford these swords or I don't have room for them. Swords aren't practical for 99.9% of us, they are a hobby. But a huge percentage of human beings have hobbies and those hobbies have real value. Your collection is awesome, inspiring, and allows you to generate art that I stare at lovingly from afar and sometimes steal to decorate my desktops or show off typology to friends and coworkers. Where does practicality come in to play with that?

There are times when people genuinely need to reduce their collections. If you buy a sword the same month you are getting evicted from your home, you need to get help. If your swords are rusting away in a basement closet, you might as well let them go, and if your spouse makes you miserable over them...you've got a decision I guess.

On the other hand, even a very large collection of swords and armour can be tastfully displayed in a pretty small room if necessary. A dinner for two at a really nice restaurant will cost $300 and its completely gone in 48 hours.

I do have some swords that I'm not as crazy about as I once was or thought I'd be. I may try to sell them off some day. But sell a sword that I occasionally take down off the wall and admire; one that I take a cut through the air and think maybe the POB should be half an inch further back, unless...I'm fighting an unarmoured opponent wearing heavy clothes; one that I routinely grab to describe the evolution of stiff sharp sword blades to counter improving plate armour? Not on your life, Brother.
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Patrick Kelly




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PostPosted: Sun 10 Jul, 2011 2:20 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Nathan,

You've always had a wonderfully discriminating taste in your collecting. Your collection has always been one to admire and for some, envy. However, as you've often heard me say, this is all just "stuff". Like you I've been involved in this hobby for quite some time and for myself, I've long moved past the point where I have any desire to keep accumulating "stuff". I just don't feel the need to own one of everything or as much as anyone else anymore.

You need to ask yourself a few questions: am I owning the stuff or is the stuff owning me? Is it enriching my life or becoming a burden? Where does the real value lay, in possessing the stuff or in what the stuff has taught you? If value lies in possession then you have a larger problem to overcome, if it lies in the knowledge learned, you take that with you regardless of the number of swords you own. For myself If needed I could trim my collection down to two swords and not feel too much pain over it (I'm sure you know which two those are). In fact, I often look around the "armory" and wonder if I'm getting a bit tired of have all this stuff hanging around. The size of the collection doesn't change what I've learned, nor do I feel the need to keep up with other collectors.

I'm sure you can look at the collection and decide which pieces really mean something to you and which ones are just kind of cool to have, and you do have a bit of redundancy going on there. It's all just stuff brother. Big Grin

"In valor there is hope.".................. Tacitus
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Thu 21 Jul, 2011 12:04 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've enjoyed reading the responses to this topic. Since it's died down, I'll just take a moment to add that I've sold a few items already and intend to sell a few more. Progress is being made.
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J.D. Crawford




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PostPosted: Thu 21 Jul, 2011 12:52 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Some of the comments above (about not missing bygone swords) got me thinking of all the swords I have sold, returned, or given away (mostly a lot of Windlass swords that I picked up at Reliks), and whether I miss any of them.

Indeed there are a couple I miss, and that made me think, why? Obviously I got rid of them for a reason, so there must also have been something I liked.

One was the Windlass Crusader Sword: http://www.myArmoury.com/review_mrl_crus.html From what I recall, I returned it because the screw-on pommel came loose very quickly and the handle turned out to be glued on. More fundamentally (I was much earlier on the learning curve back then), I realized that the hilt furniture was not historically accurate for the blade type, and the handling was a bit dead. So why do I still miss it years later? I liked the double fuller XIII blade. So there's a gap still to be filled - and probably a custom project to come.

The other one I miss is the Windlass Classic Medieval Sword. This one was quite good and solid, but I sold it because I was getting better and more refined swords of a similar type. Why do I miss it? I just liked the way it felt in my hand. And it was a semi-blunt so I could wind it around in the basement or backyard in a more care-free fashion than the sharp swords that replaced it in my collection.

A couple of other swords I don't miss per se, but I miss the cocked-hat pommel. Looking back, I'm pretty sure that's why I bought both of them (the pommel), but the swords attached to them did not deliver what I wanted. I still don't have an example of this pommel right now - but that's the subject of my current custom commission.

That's admittedly only a small proportion my x-swords missed, but there's some instructive nostalgia there.

Doesn't anyone else miss anything about their previous swords? Maybe this should be a separate thread.
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Mark T




PostPosted: Sat 28 Jan, 2012 2:29 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Apologies for slight thread necro, but as this discussion veered into the hows and whys of collecting, I thought folks might like to read the 'Ten basic rules every collector should know' published on the Nihonto Message Board: http://www.nihontomessageboard.com/faq.html

I'm sorely tempted to post them all here - a few go beyond standard advice, and they contain a lot of wisdom. However, it's worth folks visiting that forum if they haven't before; it's Nihonto-focussed, but the general 'rules' for collecting are still relevant.

Here are two as a taster, as they relate most to some of the questions and advice given above:

Quote:
2. Buy what you like and what you can afford. Don't strain the budget looking to acquire. The prudent sequence is; fund comfortably, acquire advantageously, enjoy profusely, learn extensively, liquidate equitably, repeat as needed.

3. Take from the bottom, add to the top. A singular great work carries far more merit in a collection than a room full of low end junk. Great is always great. Junk will always be junk. Always has been, always will be. But starting at the top is not within the capacity of most folks, and starting with lower levels (not junk though) can build experience, knowledge, and savvy. Eventually, as knowledge, experience, and tastes improve, these pieces can be used as markers to augment moving into the next levels, by selling or bartering them into other pieces. Every acquisition should attempt to build equity to a future "better" piece. Take from the bottom, add to the top.


Mark T

PS Nathan: Thanks, as always, for generously sharing your collection, and for everything you do. And thanks for your advice and encouragement on mine these last few years ... you know which pieces of yours I'd purchase without hesitation, should you ever decide to move them on!

Chief Librarian/Curator, Isaac Leibowitz Librarmoury

Schallern sind sehr sexy!
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Jimi Edmonds




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PostPosted: Sun 29 Jan, 2012 10:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Is there any way you could lease some of your collection to like art galleries or museams? Then people would see them, you'd keep them and possibly earn coin from them..possibly?
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Daniel Wallace




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PostPosted: Mon 30 Jan, 2012 9:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

my parents are both - collects in a sense. my mother, her collection is what i consider out of hand. her collecting consists of she sees something and gets it (dolls and doll parts). (granted she gets most of this from yard sales and flea markets) point is, she has about 5000 items in her collection. it's over taken the house, in fact i've promised my old man that i wouldn't move out of the house because if i did, my room would just get crammed with her collection and he'd have to put up with it. she also cannot part with these things, how can you not part with a fragmented doll leg!?!?! "i might find the mate at a swap meet somewhere next week" she'll tell me.

my dad on the other hand, is just as bad he just doesn't realize it. granted his collection is smaller but more costly (firearms). and the only time he parts with a piece it's usually one of mine and he doesn't tell me about it until the deal is already done Mad i actually made him buy back a 20gage i used to have that he had sold to a friend. Evil

both of them, don't exactly like my collection too much. now to them, they see no value in a sword because you can't really do much with them other than stick them on a wall and look at them like fine art. Worried i'd like to think that i don't have the collect bug as bad as either of them,becausee i may spend a good bit of money on a sword, but i only go after one - like every few years - if that. and i don't see the use of keeping a piece if it's not functional, unless it's a gift. iusuallyy draw the line at - what can i lean from this piece? vs, it's nice and i really want it.


but what comes to mind when i see Nathans collection is something that i remembered hearing about William Randel Hurst and his collection ofeuropeann art, the notion that he wasn't just collecting to collect but preserving history. Nathan you have a ton of wonderful works in your collection, to have so many examples in one place - what do you think about opening amuseumm of modern reproductions? Big Grin
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Nathan Robinson
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PostPosted: Thu 01 Aug, 2013 12:21 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I really need to get off my ass and sell more of this stuff. I need the space!
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