Posts: 1,191 Location: San Francisco, CA
Wed 14 Jul, 2004 8:12 pm
| Taylor Ellis wrote: |
| I think a good direction to go with this line may be to attach each sword with a style. For example, a mortuary hilt for Silver, a 15th century longsword for Ringeck/Fiore, a XIV for 1.33, an XIIa for Harlien and so on. :) |
Pardon my ignorance. Who/ what manuscript is "Harlien" ?
Cheers,
Alexi
Posts: 408
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 12:32 am
Sorry, it's spelled Harleian. :confused:
It's an early 15th century English longsword manual. The reasons I suggested for naming the XIIa as the Harleian is because the popularity of this bladetype makes it commercially attractive for Albion to produce, and Paul Wagner, one of the leading English longsword reconstructors in the world, related to me his belief that the sword used in this manual is much more of a cutter than it's German and Italian contemporaries. So, IMO, the closest we have to a manual using the 13th/ early 14th century longsword is the Harleian. YMMV. :lol:
Posts: 1,191 Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 7:40 am
| Taylor Ellis wrote: |
Sorry, it's spelled Harleian. :confused:
It's an early 15th century English longsword manual. The reasons I suggested for naming the XIIa as the Harleian is because the popularity of this bladetype makes it commercially attractive for Albion to produce, and Paul Wagner, one of the leading English longsword reconstructors in the world, related to me his belief that the sword used in this manual is much more of a cutter than it's German and Italian contemporaries. So, IMO, the closest we have to a manual using the 13th/ early 14th century longsword is the Harleian. YMMV. :lol: |
Thank you. Now I have heard of another manuscript :D Seems like it is not well interpreted. I only found an article on the ARMA site with some interpretation on it.
Do not want to change the subject though.
Alexi
Posts: 1,717 Location: Buffalo, NY.
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 9:57 am
Baron Alexi,
Should that be your new designation? Well, I assume you have not received your sword yet or you would have written something, but we must get together when you do. I hope that everything is well with you. Jeremy
Posts: 1,717 Location: Buffalo, NY.
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 10:00 am
:wtf: I meant to send that as a PM. Distracted I guess. . .
Posts: 416 Location: Podgorje, Kamnik, Slovenia, Europe
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 11:42 am
Re: myArmoury Exclusive Preview -- The Squire Line
| Howard Waddell wrote: |
...with the beginner, reenactor and practitioner of the Western Martial Arts in mind...
... excellent "practice" swords for their counterparts in the NextGen line...
...All swords will be hot peened and have a simple black leather-wrapped grip. The swords will not be made sharp, but will have "flat" edges suitable for reenactment and swordplay exercise. ...
...The "Squire line" is still a wonderful idea as a cheaper sword will allow practitioners to do steel on steel practices and be more adventurous (hopefully without getting in to attempts to cut iron chains and locks, helmets and other things that were not meant to be cut with a sword) in their cutting practices...
Howy |
Hi, folks at Albion. I have a simple question, and I think I’m not the only one who’s interested in this issue.
:\
If I understand this correctly, "Squire line" swords will be assembled the same way as NexGen swords - wedged (or fixed) cross and pommel, two piece wooden grip, covered with cord and leather. What happens if the sword gets struck *a lot or strongly* on the cross in let's say swordplay exercise? If the cross becomes loose, then it's impossible to fix it "in the kitchen" – the only way I can imagine is by completely removing leather and wooden grip, and then try to wedge or compress the cross back.. And then of course add new grip. Not a simple and cheap process.
Is this a possible drawback of this otherwise far superior grip assembly? Fixing a simple “sandwich” assembled sword is much simpler – you can quite easily repeen or tighten the screw on the pommel – to a certain extent.
So, is this potential problem being addressed? Will there be some destructive tests of prototypes? Can we come and watch? :D
Thank you in advance for your answer, and best wishes in your business (and private life),
Blaž
Posts: 717 Location: Wisconsin, USA
Thu 15 Jul, 2004 1:09 pm
Re: myArmoury Exclusive Preview -- The Squire Line
| Blaz Berlec wrote: |
| Howard Waddell wrote: | ...with the beginner, reenactor and practitioner of the Western Martial Arts in mind...
... excellent "practice" swords for their counterparts in the NextGen line...
...All swords will be hot peened and have a simple black leather-wrapped grip. The swords will not be made sharp, but will have "flat" edges suitable for reenactment and swordplay exercise. ...
...The "Squire line" is still a wonderful idea as a cheaper sword will allow practitioners to do steel on steel practices and be more adventurous (hopefully without getting in to attempts to cut iron chains and locks, helmets and other things that were not meant to be cut with a sword) in their cutting practices...
Howy |
Hi, folks at Albion. I have a simple question, and I think I’m not the only one who’s interested in this issue.
:\
If I understand this correctly, "Squire line" swords will be assembled the same way as NexGen swords - wedged (or fixed) cross and pommel, two piece wooden grip, covered with cord and leather. What happens if the sword gets struck *a lot or strongly* on the cross in let's say swordplay exercise? If the cross becomes loose, then it's impossible to fix it "in the kitchen" – the only way I can imagine is by completely removing leather and wooden grip, and then try to wedge or compress the cross back.. And then of course add new grip. Not a simple and cheap process.
Is this a possible drawback of this otherwise far superior grip assembly? Fixing a simple “sandwich” assembled sword is much simpler – you can quite easily repeen or tighten the screw on the pommel – to a certain extent.
So, is this potential problem being addressed? Will there be some destructive tests of prototypes? Can we come and watch? :D
Thank you in advance for your answer, and best wishes in your business (and private life),
Blaž |
Hey Blaz!
The Squire Line, like the NextGen line, will constructed just like period originals and are guaranteed to take the same punishment as a period original.
However, "blade on blade" or stage combat is a very different thing. For a small additional fee, we could go beyond period construction and further secure the guard to avoid this possibility -- talk to Mike if that is something you would be interested in pursuing.
And yes, we do destructive testing all of the time -- you are always welcome to visit and see!
Best,
Howy
Posts: 22
Fri 16 Jul, 2004 6:26 am
hehe, While your offer to come and see the construction process if VERY nice Mr. Waddell , I would have to point out his the fact that Mr Berlec seems to live in eastern europe .
Posts: 501 Location: Purcellville, VA
Sat 17 Jul, 2004 5:58 am
Squire scabbards?
For reenactors it would be really nice to have an accompanying line of scabbards with historic look but not necessarily construction that are also priced accessibly. Just a thought...
Posts: 427 Location: Crown Point, IN
Sat 17 Jul, 2004 1:21 pm
Re: myArmoury Exclusive Preview -- The Squire Line
| Geoff Wood wrote: |
| Howard Waddell wrote: |
The Viking (Type H hilt, one piece pommel, Geibig 4 blade) -- $300
|
Petersen mentions a couple of Type H hilts with fused pommel and upper guard. Would the squire type H be similar to either of these? |
The pommel will be a type "H" just in one piece.
Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden
Sat 17 Jul, 2004 2:44 pm
Re: Squire scabbards?
| Gordon Clark wrote: |
| For reenactors it would be really nice to have an accompanying line of scabbards with historic look but not necessarily construction that are also priced accessibly. Just a thought... |
Historically accurate scabbards are severely underestimated as a products. Few understand how involved a proper scabbard is to make.
To even get close to something historically accurate demands many hours of hand work. That will put it in another group than the Squire line.
Without having talked to the rest of the gang, the only slolution I can think of is a version of the campaign scabbards that would go with the Squire line.
It means streamlining and shortcuts in the manufacture to get them within a lean budget. It will not allow much in the way of real historical accuracy, but it might be possible to make something that is in some sort of harmony with the swords.
Not to be totally negative about this idea, but it would take some hard thinking to find the right compromizes.
Perhaps an interesting development?
Posts: 411 Location: Göteborg Sweden
Sat 17 Jul, 2004 8:02 pm
Hi!
Eric McHugh
This Viking type "H" one piece pommel, is it like heatshrinked on place or is it hotpeened?
i just want to know how it is sitting there on the tang.
Patrik
Posts: 427 Location: Crown Point, IN
Sat 17 Jul, 2004 11:59 pm
| Patrik Erik Lars Lindblom wrote: |
Hi!
Eric McHugh
This Viking type "H" one piece pommel, is it like heatshrinked on place or is it hotpeened?
i just want to know how it is sitting there on the tang.
Patrik |
Hej Patrik!
Thanks for question. The process is the same as our higher priced swords. We will wedge the pommel in place on the tang. The wedging process is what provides most of the security of the pommel on the tang, then it is hot peened to finish the job. I'm not really sure what you mean by "heatshrinked." If you are asking if we heat up the pommel to provide a tighter fit, well that is one way to do it, but we have such a close fit between our tangs and pommels that the simple act of driving the pommel onto the tang makes it near impossible to remove the pommel. Once peened the pommel is permanently fixed to the tang.
Posts: 411 Location: Göteborg Sweden
Sun 18 Jul, 2004 8:15 am
| Eric McHugh wrote: |
| Patrik Erik Lars Lindblom wrote: | Hi!
Eric McHugh
This Viking type "H" one piece pommel, is it like heatshrinked on place or is it hotpeened?
i just want to know how it is sitting there on the tang.
Patrik |
Hej Patrik!
Thanks for question. The process is the same as our higher priced swords. We will wedge the pommel in place on the tang. The wedging process is what provides most of the security of the pommel on the tang, then it is hot peened to finish the job. I'm not really sure what you mean by "heatshrinked." If you are asking if we heat up the pommel to provide a tighter fit, well that is one way to do it, but we have such a close fit between our tangs and pommels that the simple act of driving the pommel onto the tang makes it near impossible to remove the pommel. Once peened the pommel is permanently fixed to the tang. |
Hej igen Eric!
Well, that was what i mean with that "home made" english word :D
now i know little more about the pommel and tang.
Tackar!
Patrik
Posts: 416 Location: Podgorje, Kamnik, Slovenia, Europe
Sun 18 Jul, 2004 10:52 am
Re: myArmoury Exclusive Preview -- The Squire Line
| Howard Waddell wrote: |
And yes, we do destructive testing all of the time -- you are always welcome to visit and see!
Howy |
Thank you for your explanation and invitation. Unfortunately, New Glarus seems a bit far (couldn't really remember where in USA Wisconsin really is - had to look on the map).
| Tom Wegener wrote: |
hehe, While your offer to come and see the construction process if VERY nice Mr. Waddell , I would have to point out his the fact that Mr Berlec seems to live in eastern europe . |
Err... Well, I like to think I live in Central Europe. You know, that part of the continent that is considered Eastern by Western Europe and Western by Eastern Europe. But yes, I’m from that vicinity. A quick link to small site with pictures and descriptions of this not so much used term: http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Central_Europe
I totally agree that historically accurate scabbards and sword belts are severely underestimated. Not just as products, even as parts of medieval military equipment, and it’s quite hard to get accurate information about them from literature.
And sorry for not writing earlier – I’ve been above 1100 meters (3600 feet) for the whole weekend, with sword and all equipment and some 35 friends on our national Tolkien Society annual gathering in a high alpine meadow. Had a really great time, totally cut off of the problems of every day’s life, TV, radio, electricity and mobile phones. Great experience, but now I really have to take a shower. :eek:
Posts: 820 Location: Texas
Sun 18 Jul, 2004 12:57 pm
Re: myArmoury Exclusive Preview -- The Squire Line
| Geoff Wood wrote: |
| Eric McHugh wrote: | | Geoff Wood wrote: | | Howard Waddell wrote: |
The Viking (Type H hilt, one piece pommel, Geibig 4 blade) -- $300
|
Petersen mentions a couple of Type H hilts with fused pommel and upper guard. Would the squire type H be similar to either of these? |
The pommel will be a type "H" just in one piece. |
Mr McHugh
Thanks for the reply. Sorry for the imprecision of my question. I'll try again. Given the variety of shapes encompassed by the definition, 'type H', I was wondering if it would be an idea to make the choice somewhat more historically accurate as well as economical by basing the design on one of the recovered examples that was also one piece when made in the viking era.
Regards
Geoff |
This Steinvik Farm sword (Somewhere between H and D?) has always been one of my favorites. Underneath all the decoration seems to be some very fine proportions... Would be nice if this new Viking squire had a similar hilt style and lines. I might be tempted to get one and add some wire decoration and age it a little.
ks
Posts: 634 Location: UK
Sun 18 Jul, 2004 1:18 pm
Lovely picture. Maybe I should get that book. I'd probably call that a D, but whatever you call it, its a looker.
gw
Posts: 5,739 Location: Wichita, Kansas
Sun 18 Jul, 2004 1:23 pm
| Geoff Wood wrote: |
Lovely picture. Maybe I should get that book. I'd probably call that a D, but whatever you call it, its a looker.
gw |
I highly recommend this book. It's a long overdue addition to the field, and a must have for anyone with an interest in Viking swords.
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