Thanks for your close-up research! If you compare that with the Tula-looks its the same. I think we can be quite sure about the origin now. Russian, thats interesting.

My goal was from the beginning to find a nice civil flintlockrifle for a reenactment garb as a hunter. Turned out that I soon got two military muskets, one tula and a brown bess that I bought some time ago... :wtf:

Hi anders

Nice piece I have to agree with hunter about the weapons not taking a a bayonet It appears to be full stocked in the photo it is possible it was made for civil sale and never intended to have one. The lock may well have been made after the type went out of government use or surplus sold to some smith who made up the weapon for sale to hunters.

Finally I got the musket, always some problem with the postal service.

It´s a really nice musket, very slender, light and practical. It´s russian, the lock is marked Tula and underneath its also marked 1811. The lock is in good condition, all springs works fine. The cock is damage and the frizzen is not original but quite old. Those parts are about to be replaced with modern ones att some time. The barrel is marked 1806 and AB.

The musket is remodelled for hunting, the barrel is shortened and the front barrelband is replaced with a rather crude ironband. The ramrod is perhaps the original but its to short and looks primitive. The stock has several marks and a hole, I dont know whats been there. I suspect that they have carved out some material for the cheek/chin inte the stock.

It´s well suited for a huntinggarb I guess. Its a nice musket and I´m quite satisfied.

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the lock in total.

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Closeup of the lock engraving

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The backside of the lock.

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the hole in the wood.

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The marks on the wood and a bit of the carved out part.

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The front barrelband

Hmm... about the hole in the stock, the Swedish military placed a disc in the stock of guns to list their condition, unit and rack number. I don't know when this practice began or to which guns it was applied. If this was a military capture this may be a possibility.

Here is an example:


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However, I can say for certain that putting discs in gun stocks has been popular since the 19th century. This was done sometimes by shooting clubs or towns when a gun was being given as a gift or had won a competition.

Like this one from a shooting club:

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GREAT FIND. As to "converting" a mil to civilian use, (if that is what this was) was guite common.

Puffer

News on the Tula-front. There has been more research and more interesting facts has been discovered!

The latest thing is that this could actually be a Charleville musket of model 1777, BUT with a Tula-flintlock. :eek: The Tula muskets is normaly not stamped on the barrel, but my is with AB and 1806 which is older than the lock. All the furniture on my example is made of iron, the Tula muskets are made of brass. The springs for the barrelbands are situated before the barrelbands on the Charleville on models before 1807, just like the Tula muskets.

There were several french muskets captured by the russians in 1812...

That's very possible. It wasn't uncommon to build new muskets using other parts or repair muskets with other parts when they were available and it was necessary or just to use up what was left in stock.

I might suggest that perhaps only the barrel is French. The lock is certainly Russian and Tula muskets were made with both iron and brass furniture. The trigger and guard is not a style I've ever seen on any French 1777's but I have seen it on Tula's and French 1763/1766's. Judging just from the photographs though, I would say it (the trigger and guard) looks closer to Tula 1808 than French 1763/66.

I've done a very brief search for the "AB" stampings to see what the stand for (maker or proof?) but haven't found anything conclusive yet. I have found a French carbine from the 1840's with "AB" stamped on the barrel so that might be something.

May I trouble you for a picture of the barrel stampings and any markings that may be on the buttplate?

So perhaps anyone is interested in what I did with the Tula-musket. I never got the time or money to get the proper parts. Today I went to a antique arms-fair and sold it to a russian dealer for a 1000 euro. I doubled my money spent on it and I bought something for me better.

A good, wellworking swedish hunting flintlock, around 1750 and a poor condition late 18th C hunting rifle. Both with a good price, one alot cheaper than the other. I hope to renovate the cheap rifle to something good, the lock does not belong to it but with some care it will work.

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Look out my homepage for more pics! Its in swedish but you can always translate it or just watch the pics!

http://kurage.wordpress.com/