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Peter Spätling
Industry Professional
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 Posted: Sat 31 Dec, 2016 12:50 pm Post subject: |
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Got it, the guy was called "Georg (or Jörg) von Ehingen", there 's only a german wikipedia article about him.
This is his original work from the 15th century. The title on the homepage says: "Knight Georg's von Ehingen autobiography - Cod.hist.qt.141"
To download it click on "Ganzes Werk herunterladen"
There are several translations available:
Modern German: K. Krauss, in: Georg von Ehingen. Höfling, Ritter, Landvogt. Eine Ausstellung im Winter 1986/87, Tübingen 1986, pp. 17-42
Modern English: M. Letts, The diary of Jörg von Ehingen, London 1929
"Modern" Spanish: A. M. Fabié, in Libros de antaño nuevamente dados à luz por varios aficionados, 8, Madrid 1879, 1-46 Auszüge zu Orten in Spanien
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Dan Howard
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| Posted: Sat 31 Dec, 2016 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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The only definition of "double mail" I can find is in al-Nuwairi's 14th C Nihayat al-Arb (vol. 6)..He wrote “doubled mail (muda'afa) refers to that which is woven two rings by two rings". This suggests that the Middle Eastern definition of “double mail” was a weave that uses twice as many links, such as 6-in-1 or 8-in 2, but the Europeans may have used the term differently.
Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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Eric S
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| Posted: Sat 31 Dec, 2016 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Dan Howard wrote: | | The only definition of "double mail" I can find is in al-Nuwairi's 14th C Nihayat al-Arb (vol. 6)..He wrote “doubled mail (muda'afa) refers to that which is woven two rings by two rings". This suggests that the Middle Eastern definition of “double mail” was a weave that uses twice as many links, such as 6-in-1 or 8-in 2, but the Europeans may have used the term differently. |
The Japanese version of "double mail".
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Pedro Paulo Gaião
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| Posted: Fri 25 Aug, 2017 5:25 am Post subject: |
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| Benjamin H. Abbott wrote: | | Yes, it happened by Ceuta around 1457. Note that von Ehingen doesn't seem to have had a shield in encounter; he at least never mentioned one, while he noted his opponent's shield repeatedly. The Moorish champion's armor doesn't come up in the text again. I'm surprised by how the opponent's spear stuck in von Ehingen's armor. As he was wearing a white harness, it must have partially penetrated into steel, though not enough to wound him. |
He wasn't wearing white harness, but armor of brigandine construction provided by the Portuguese Crown to him and other mercenaries in previous occasions (he enjoyed tournaments and feasts in the portuguese court, in one of those he was presented with the armor). Besides armor, Ehingen records in the episode he was mounted in a strong jennet provided by king Afonso V, of which von Ehingen held in high regard. I believe he was fighting in the jinete manner; even if he was using his own weapons, the armor and the horse were not of his own (i.e. those he brought from Austria while travelling for mercenary service). Perhaps that would explain why the lance struck in his armor; since he was wearing mail underneath it, he wasn't injured in the strike too.
In any case, if he was fighting a la jineta manner, he would probably using a adarga leather shield while riding, along with an estoque (longsword/bastard sword), espada (sword) and a dagger; so, theorically, he could be wearing a shield too if the said was provided by the portuguese. The heaviest style of ginete armor, perhaps unusually at Portugal, would include arm and leg harness of plates (without plate for shoulders).
I'm not an expert of the german language, so I got more or less the idea of this while translating at Google:
| Jörg von Ehingen wrote: | | Der küng gabe och unser jedem ain starken Jennetta, und vir unsere knecht jedem ain ringharnisch, brigenndin genant. Also ward ain guot folk vom hoff und sunst verordnet, hin zuo ziehen. Als mir nun guot folk vom hoff und sunst verordnet, hin zuo ziehen. Als mir nun uff das meer kamen, schifften mir gar bald hiniber usz Portengall in Affrica… |
He's saying he got something like a set of mail and brigandine armor in Portugal before shipping to Africa. This extract also mentions the jennet horse he got.
A friend gave me these links, which tells more of this history:
https://www.karwansaraypublishers.com/mwblog/fun-games-deadly-serious-diary-german-knight/
German: https://blackcentraleurope.com/sources/1000-1500/georg-von-ehingen-tells-of-fighting-heathens-in-north-africa-1457/
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Peter Spätling
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Fri 25 Aug, 2017 6:29 am Post subject: |
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"Der küng gabe och unser jedem ain starken Jennetta, und vir unsere knecht jedem ain ringharnisch, brigenndin genant"
"The king also gave everyone of us a strong genet, and for our servants each a maille haubergeon, called "brigenndin"."
The servants got maille armour which is called brigenndin in this case. While the Jörg and probably the other knights, each received a Genet horse.
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Benjamin H. Abbott
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| Posted: Sun 27 Aug, 2017 9:02 am Post subject: |
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According to Pieter B.'s translation on the first page, von Ehingen was using a lance rest. Are their brigandines with lance rests?
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Pieter B.
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| Posted: Sun 27 Aug, 2017 3:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Benjamin H. Abbott wrote: | | According to Pieter B.'s translation on the first page, von Ehingen was using a lance rest. Are their brigandines with lance rests? |
A quick and dirt google search showed this: http://www.eduref.net/kct/armour/chalcis/
| Quote: | | Plate LIV, nos. 1-3 (145, 76, no number). These are breast- and backplates which reinforced brigandines. No. 1 for the right breast, has the toothed bracket to which the lance-rest was affixed. The teeth are bored vertically with square holes, through which the square-shanked pin was passed to hold the lance rest in position. These plates are not common in armouries, and are very rare when in their original state on the brigandine. |
And another image google turned up.
I am still quite confident he used a lance rest. In the initial charge his lance ended up in his opponents shield and the shock threw both the moor and the horse he was riding to the ground. That sounds consistent with what we know about the impact of a couched lance rested in an arret.
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Dan Howard
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| Posted: Sun 27 Aug, 2017 3:48 pm Post subject: |
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There are quite a few extant brigandines with lance rests. The term "lance rest" isn't a good name.because it gives a false impression of its function. The French arrêt tells us the real function of this item.
Author: Bronze Age Military Equipment, Pen and Sword Books
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