[Carlo Arellano]

I am trying to decide between Albion's Talhoffer or Arms and Armor's Durer Bastard sword. I'm looking for people, most notably Bill, who have handled both swords to give me input. This is an incredible site and it seemed like the best place to ask this question.

[Bill Grandy]

[M. Eversberg II]

Welcome to the forums.

M.

[Bob Burns]

Welcome Carlo, well you certainly have very good taste! I own the Durer, it's an outstanding sword and very swift. I came real close to buying the Talhoffer but went with a custom Black Prince from Arms & Armor instead after a 3 month debate with myself.

You cannot go wrong on either sword Carlo!

Bob

[Ciaran Daly]

I haven't handled both but I just received my Talhoffer a few weeks ago and I have to say I'm extremely impressed. It just seems to flow between guards. I've handled a few A&A swords over the years (I made a point of stopping by their booth at the Ren Fest every year for the last 20 and I have to give them credit for stoking my fascination with historical weapons). They are very good at what they do. I have to say though that after handling an Albion they might not be quite up there with the folks in New Glarus. Given how close they are in price point, I'd go with an Albion personally.

[Jason Elrod]

I've owned both swords and I prefer the Durer but that's only because generally speaking I like swords oriented more for the cut than the thrust.

They are both excellent swords and you can't go wrong with either.

I agree with Bill that the Durer is a more "All Around" sword and would recommend it for a first sword just on that "classification" so to speak. It'll be able to do anything you would like it to do fairly well. Once you figure out what you like in a sword, handling speaking, then you can branch out into something more "specialized" like an Oakshott Type XVII.

If you just care about looks then I'd go with the Talhoffer. It's just a beautifully designed and executed sword. Albion also seems to have a more refined finish to their swords than A&A. Personally Albion's swords are a little too refined for my taste but I'm definately in the minority with that opinion. And unlike Bill, I prefer A&A's grips over Albion's. They seem more practical. That being said, I've never seen either an A&A or Albion wrap come undone so, again, it all comes down to aesthetics and what you personally like.

Good luck.

[Joe Fults]

The swords are pretty different in the first person. both are nice enough. Neither one makes my heart do somersaults. Personally I'd go with whichever one you can actually get in hand first but that's just because I'm really tired of protracted waits and missed deadlines on projects (from vendors in general).

[Carlo Arellano]

Thank you all for the responses. After doing research on this rather scholarly site I was able to make an educated guess and narrow down my choices to those two. After years of unarmored full contact FMA I have decided to pursue WMA with longsword as the basis of my studies in European martial arts. Unfortunately, training stick almost exclusively has given me some bad blade alignment habits and from the feedback it seems that the Durer would be sightly better in correcting these habits during my cutting exercises. I'm the ape on the right.



I have a wooden waster coming soon and I also plan on picking up arming clothes from revival as well as the Meyer from Albion's Maestro line. I will be upgrading my beat up old fencing mask from my Dogbrothers' fighting days to this one: http://www.thatguysproducts.com/gallery.html

Any other input on gear and sources to study from would be greatly appreciated. Again, I would like to thank you all for the friendly and very informative responses.

Sincerely,

Carlo Arellano

[Bob Burns]

Thanks Carlo for the martial arts pictures, it brings back fond memories of the crazy all out unarmed free style karate and ground and pound that I used to do at National Karate and Hackney's Combat Academy before I was forced out in late 2004 after the diagnosis of arthritis all thru my spine plus 5 minor hernias, 2 in the cervical and 3 in the lumbar. How did I get all this junk in my back? By being "Bob" ! Yep, I was an "Ape" too!

Your going to absolutely Love your Durer Bastard Sword, I would never sell mine and it was highly recommended to me by David Peck, a longsword instructor, former mgr. of the A & A Boothe at the Bristol Faire and a contributor to a couple of the books by Christian Henry Tobler. David told me it was the best longsword he's ever handled.
I have to agree, but I am No authority on longsword!

Thanks again for the photos, I personally really enjoyed them, we knocked face cages off each other, I accidentally knocked a guy out one time, and I've had my bell rung a few times (however I was never "knocked out"), hopefully I did not incure any brain damage but sometimes I wonder about that? Was lot's of fun

Bob

[Bob Burns]

Oh by the way Carlo, I forgot to mention this in my previous post. In regard to the Durer Bastard Sword by Arms & Armor,
it is also available at Kult of Athena. Although it is not listed on the website, trust me, the Durer is hanging on the wall in pristine condition waiting for a home, I was just there this past Saturday and I saw it hanging on the wall in the premium section reserved for Albion Swords and Arms & Armor. Although the rest of the showroom is set up so that Japanese swords are with Japanese swords, Roman Swords with Roman Swords, Viking swords with Viking swords, and so on.
Except for "Albion Swords" and "Arms & Armor" swords, being that both these companies are absolute 1st Class Sword Manufacturers, they are therefore all kept together, the Albion Section is adjacent to the Arms & Armor Section and all Albions Swords are with Albions Swords and all Arms & Armor products are with Arms & Armor.
Ryan does this in appreciation and observance of the extreme high quality of these two companies.

However, let us not forget there are some amazing "Private Swordsmiths" out there who's quality is impeccable!
There's just too many to list and I don't want to make the mistake of forgetting to list any one of them therefore I won't list any of them. But anyone can certainly find who they are from the many experienced collectors in this website! All of whom happen to be a whole lot more learned than I am, I am just a beginner in my 3rd year of collecting and as of yet have much to learn! Which is exactly why I frequent this website and make annual donations to help support myArmoury, which in my opinion is the most magnificent website for us collectors anywhere on the Internet

Even though I went with the custom Black Prince, the particular customizing which I speak of is an extra $100.00 ( I am authorized to quote this by Craig). I had some of the character of the Talhoffer / Agincourt blade by Albion Swords configured into my custom Black Prince. Although it is not as thick as the Albion sword, it is much thicker than the standard Black Prince and is much more acutely tapered in the distal section of the blade, while maintaining the main characteristics of the standard Black Prince. Therefore my Black Prince is a much more stiff or should I say "stout" blade and a more vicious thrusting sword.

Still, I am attracted to the idea of ordering an Albion Talhoffer in the not too distant future, as money allows, because I really love that sword! I was given the opportunity to handle the Talhoffer belonging to myArmoury member Chris Last at the Bristol Renaissance Faire in 2006. Let me say this, the Talhoffer is one very impressive type 15a sword if I ever saw and handled one! It's absolutely Outstanding in every respect!

Well, hope I did not break your bank by causing you to over extend yourself and order both the Durer and Talhoffer, but even so, if one is to go into hock for two swords instead of one, this is a magnificent combo!

I hope this helps somehow!

Bob