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Nicola Tal
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 Posted: Sat 03 Dec, 2005 2:38 pm Post subject: Look, probably it is Russian sword |
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Look, probably it is Russian sword
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Steve Grisetti
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| Posted: Sat 03 Dec, 2005 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: Look, probably it is Russian sword |
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| Nicola Tal wrote: | | Look, probably it is Russian sword |
Welcome, Nicola!
Can you tell us more about this sword? For example, where was the sword found? Who found the sword? When did he or she find it? Where is the sword now? Thanks!
"...dismount thy tuck, be yare in thy preparation, for thy assailant is quick, skilful, and deadly."
- Sir Toby Belch
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Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Sat 03 Dec, 2005 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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Nicola,
This is an interesting sword!
Please tell where it was found, if you can.
There are features on the hilt and blade that makes me think of celtic or roman inlfuences.
Perjhaps it *is* a celtic or roman sword?!?
The guard and grip looks to be organic material. The guard looks to be firbrous in the direction of the blade and it seems to me there is a crescent or bell shaped cut out or curve in the guard as it meets the blade (like seen on some late celtic swords). Is there also a hint of phallic "kidney shaped" swellings in the guard, like that of the "guard " of a ballock dagger? If so, this is also a feature you can see on roman and celtic swords.
The grip seems to show some transverse lines just close to the guard (some kind of textile wrap?) but this is rather unclear. Could this be a washer or some remains of decorative lines?
The pommel is also very interesting. It seems to be a rather thck and fat lens shape, like that of a early/high medieval sword (possibly with a bulging, somewhat angular outline?). It is not clear if the pommel is metallic or organic.
If it is not a very ealry sword, then it is an interesting survivor of these ancient shapes.
I might be reading far too much into these pictures.
Very interesting!
Please tell us more!
Do you have more pictures that shows some more details of the hilt?
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Nicola Tal
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 12:49 am Post subject: Re: Look, probably it is Russian sword |
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| Steve Grisetti wrote: | | Nicola Tal wrote: | | Look, probably it is Russian sword |
Welcome, Nicola!
Can you tell us more about this sword? For example, where was the sword found? Who found the sword? When did he or she find it? Where is the sword now? Thanks! |
This sword is found in Russia (in Kareliya). It is stored in Estonia. It very short.
I shall measure the sizes and to you I shall inform
It seems to me, that this sword ritual
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Alex Oster
Location: Washington and Yokohama Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 410
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 1:13 am Post subject: |
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Hmm... I'm leaning towards Chinese origin. But I'm no expert.
Hope this spurs some thought though.
-Alex
The pen is mightier than the sword, especially since it can get past security and be stabbed it into a jugular.
This site would be better if everytime I clicked submit... I got to hear a whip crack!
My collection: Various Blades & Conan related
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Hisham Gaballa
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 4:11 am Post subject: |
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My first thought when seeing it was that's a Roman gladius or spatha. 
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Patrik Erik Lars Lindblom
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 4:30 am Post subject: |
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Can you show a side view of it to,
it's look's like the pommel are in two parts,
really nice sword that one and beautiful to. 
Frid o Fröjd!
Patrik
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Wolfgang Armbruster
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 5:35 am Post subject: |
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If it was found in Kareliya, then it's probably Finnish.
As Hisham already pointed out, it really looks a bit like a roman piece.
We could be deceived by the rust though. The romans never came this far. So I guess it's some kind of Finnish dagger / short sword.
Any info on how old this sword actually is?
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Nicola Tal
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 6:08 am Post subject: I think it about 13-14 century. It is long 63 sm |
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I think it about 13-14 century. It is long 63 sm.Russian-Finnish sword
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Addison C. de Lisle
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 2:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Alex Oster wrote: | Hmm... I'm leaning towards Chinese origin. But I'm no expert.
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I agree. But also, I'm not an expert either.
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think the wood (and that is what it looks like to me) around the base of the blade is a guard. In the larger picture, I think I can see a short metal guard directly above the wooden part; I'd say the organic material is rather the remains of a scabbard.
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Nicola Tal
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 2:49 pm Post subject: In Kareliya never was Chineses !!! |
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| Addison C. de Lisle wrote: | | Alex Oster wrote: | Hmm... I'm leaning towards Chinese origin. But I'm no expert.
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I agree. But also, I'm not an expert either. |
In Kareliya never was Chineses 
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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Kareliya is one bit of land Finland lost to Soviet Union in the Winter War. It's just North-East of the Baltic Sea.
No Chinese anywhere close by.
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Chuck Russell
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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couldnt be roman. they had wooden hilts and pommels. and wood doesnt rust
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Alex Oster
Location: Washington and Yokohama Joined: 01 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 7:24 pm Post subject: Re: In Kareliya never was Chineses !!! |
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| Nicola Tal wrote: |
In Kareliya never was Chineses |
Well, in my living room there never was a japanese man, but that dosen't mean don't have his sword 
The pen is mightier than the sword, especially since it can get past security and be stabbed it into a jugular.
This site would be better if everytime I clicked submit... I got to hear a whip crack!
My collection: Various Blades & Conan related
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Peter Johnsson
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Sun 04 Dec, 2005 11:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Mikko Kuusirati wrote: | | I don't think the wood (and that is what it looks like to me) around the base of the blade is a guard. In the larger picture, I think I can see a short metal guard directly above the wooden part; I'd say the organic material is rather the remains of a scabbard. |
Yes, I agree.
In the close up pic one can make out the remains of a narrow corss guard.
What looked like the wooden guard of a roman/celtic sword could be remains of a wooden scabbard.
Less fantastic, but much more probable.
*sigh* 
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Gavin Kisebach
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| Posted: Mon 05 Dec, 2005 12:33 am Post subject: |
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I'm voting for the missing narrow crossguard, though I had to stare at the pic till I went crosseyed to figure that out. 
What looks like woodgrain may either be the top of a scabbard, or just heavy scratches. Of course wood doesn't rust, but it can collect rust just like any other porous material. not having the sword in hand, who can say for sure?
I suspect that's a type G pommel, though the grip looks really short, as on viking swords discussed in the Viking Grip thread.
I don't normally get into swords that are that decayed (can't swing em ) but this one is mysterious, like it wants its story to be told. Great pics.
There are only two kinds of scholars; those who love ideas and those who hate them. ~ Emile Chartier
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Wolfgang Armbruster
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| Posted: Mon 05 Dec, 2005 1:54 am Post subject: |
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Maybe a comparison with other Finnish swords could help us. Does anyone know what they looked like? Any survivors?
Since the Finnish weren't vikings the swords probably had a different design than their western neighbors.
I'm no expert in this field, so I could be totally wrong :P
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Mikko Kuusirati
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| Posted: Mon 05 Dec, 2005 4:53 am Post subject: |
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| Wolfgang Armbruster wrote: | Maybe a comparison with other Finnish swords could help us. Does anyone know what they looked like? Any survivors?
Since the Finnish weren't vikings the swords probably had a different design than their western neighbors.
I'm no expert in this field, so I could be totally wrong :P |
You'd be surprised. 
Mostly, Finnish swords were very much like those of our Scandinavian and Russian neighbours. Of course, at the time Finland as such didn't exist yet, it was just this vaguely defined region between Sweden and Russia where half-human sorcerors lived...
"And sin, young man, is when you treat people like things. Including yourself. That's what sin is."
— Terry Pratchett, Carpe Jugulum
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Skripunov Anatoliy
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| Posted: Fri 09 Dec, 2005 2:51 am Post subject: Re: Look, probably it is Russian sword |
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This sword is for sale?
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This is a standard topic