[Jean Thibodeau]

Finally tried wearing as much of all my armour pieces at the same time and here are some impressions and early conclusions,
Some of you can maybe confirm some of this as: 1) Doing it right. 2) Things that are going to improve with practice and minor alterations to the armour. 3) Stuff you have just to get used to as it doesn't get easier, only easier to endure as you get used to it.

Very general conclusions: Wearing either Maille or Plate is easier to deal with than wearing both at the same time in layers.

With the Gambison and Maille trying to put on the Breast & Back plate without help just didn't work for this first attempt: Mostly the Maille kept getting folds stuck between the B & B plate and I just couldn't simultaneously buckle it on and try to tuck the folds behind the plate, my arm just couldn't reach without risking dislocating my shoulder. Also with Gambison & Maille my already wide ( Fat ) waist is even thicker making closing everything up more difficult. ( With two extra hand I think the B & B plate would fit. )
Any trick to achieve this with NO help ! Maybe if I used some light rope to keep the Maille folds close to the body I would be able to " Moosh " everything inside the plate ? Hmmmm, Maybe some sort of " shoe horn " type solution using a kitchen spatula or big wooden spoon ! ????

The B & B worked fine over Gambison alone ( Without Maille ) and the Plackard fits over the B & B and Gambison.

( Note: Except for the Hauberk and Kettle Hat these are all Mercenary's Tailor armour found on the Albion site, that I am very pleased with. )

( I should do another test with my older but tight to the body Maille shirt with 3 / 4 sleeves: Actually makes more sense under plate than the full length Hauberk. Now will this tighter shirt fit over the Gambison ? Since this one is not abrasive to the skin like my riveted Maille Hauberk, I might make this work with just a teeshirt. )

With the chaps the comfort level of the greaves at the ankle is much better: Uncomfortable but not painful. If I add a rolled up knee sock everything should be good. Also the 14th century shoes that cover the ankle bone also help a lot and they are very comfortable.

The upper leg defence is causing me zero problems, so that is one thing working perfectly thanks to an arming belt. (Indispensable accessory in my opinion. )

The Plackard and 14th century arms over Maille and Gambison also worked fine. Here also, Maille sleeves alone or plate arms alone over Gambison work best: When both are worn bending the forearm is limited to about 90 degrees as both together seem to bunch up and limit mobility.

I think I can sort of understand why " Transitional Armour " became " Transitional " : With Maille gussets to fill in the gaps in the plate armour weight and mobility are better than using a full Maille defence under the plate.

I can also see were 3 / 4 or 1 / 2 armour was also popular as keeping the lower legs free helps mobility and heat dissipation.
Wearing just the B & B and Arms over the Gambison is very comfortable for extended periods of time: Add a Helm ( Morion ) and high boots and you have light and easy to wear armour. ( Replacing the Gambison with a Buff coat would give a little extra protection. )

Getting used to the heat is what I found the most challenging: As long as you don't move much the body seems to limit it's production of heat to a degree, it reminds me of being in a heated mall in winter with heavy winter coats on. ( As long as you avoid physical effort or emotional upsets your body seems to adapt. ) Now when trying to fasten an unreachable buckle the slightest effort or frustration drive the accumulation of body heat way up. ( Now this is at a normal room temperature, and I really find it incredible that armour could be worn in the heat of Summer and even worse if the humidity is high ! )

Weight does not seem to be a problem: Got used to that easily, might be different if I was trying to run in it ....... LOL.
Can't tell exactly what the total weight of armour on me was because my scale maxed out at 300 pounds when I stepped onto it. ( So at least 70 pounds, and I didn't even wear my Eyeslot Kettle Hat. ( Was warm and sweaty enough as it was! )
Would feel sorry if I had a horse with total weight over 300 ! ( Add 10 for helm / Coif and at least 10 for weapons ! OUCH . )
( Note:Close to half of the weight is the Hauberk. )

By the way none of the above is complaining about the armour itself. I hope that these impressions are of interest and would appreciate any practical advice that might help.

In conclusion: Wearing ALL my armour pieces at the same time may not be possible or easy ( Without a Squire ..... LOL. ) but is not the only way to enjoy all of it.

By mixing and matching parts I can span many historical periods and armour style: With a Spangenhelm and kite shield with my Hauberk I have one extreme and With Morion B & B , Rapier, Archebuse etc... I can do the Renaissance. And with the Plackard added to the Maille I can be somewhere in between.

Anyway, curious about any reactions to the above: I imagine that this is stuff that anyone NEW to wearing armour has had to deal with !

[David Evans]

Now you see why plate was never worn over mail! (apart from voiders, skirt and standard)

[Anton de Vries]

Very informative and interesting post. It's making me rethink my own armour purchase strategies, especially the part about arm mobility. Thank you.

[Jonathon Janusz]

In regards to the heat issue (being one who has worn armor in summer with high humidity) I have one word:

Fabric.

As you probably already know, your under clothes/arming clothes, ideally, should be of linen, 100% wool, or some combination thereof (note that I have heard folks having success with linen shelled cotton fill gambesons). Disregarding historical accuracy for a moment, natural materials just tend to breathe and help your body's natural cooling processes better than commonly found synthetic materials. So, if for no other reason than comfort, stick as close to period-correct on this one as you can, surprisingly it works out the best.

Now, the part I wanted to stress is fabric OVER your armor. A cloak, surcoat, or tabbard will make a night and day difference in heat. Ever try to touch the hood of your car after it has been sitting in the sun all day in the summer? Remember how it feels in that same car when you first get in if the windows were up and the doors closed? Your hood is your armor and that's you inside your armor. If you put a bit of fabric over the armor (key is to put it on when the armor is cold/room temp) and wear it all day in the sun, when you touch the metal that was exposed to the sun all day it will be warm/hot to the touch while if you touch the metal under the fabric it will be noticably cooler (in the case of a little experiment I did last year, it was actually cold to the touch - the temp it was at when I took it out of my car in the morning after leaving it there all night).

Yep, them crusaders out in the desert were on to something, I think. . .




(. . . and water, lots and lots of water; juice is good, energy drink okay, try to avoid sodas and adult beverages )

[Gary Venable]

Did you get any pictures?

[Jean Thibodeau]

Gary;

No pictures YET as I don't have a digital camera but I will get a friend to take some eventually. ( A bit more experimenting first. ) ( Will eventually have to buy one I guess. )

Jonathan;

I do have a natural fabric Gambison with linen shell and cotton fill so at least I wasn't making things worse with " polyester "
I guess if going out in the Sun I will take your advice about a surcoat. Oh, water ........ WATER! yes I was feeling a bit weak there at the end. Wearing the stuff is not so bad once you succeed in buckling everything down properly, but all the " Cirque du Soleil " contortions trying to do it with varying degrees of success may be even more tiring that moving around ( I hope. )

Well custom fitted armour might be a little easier but there are no unsolvable fitting problem with a more generic " munitions " armour.

David;
Yes, reserving the full Hauberk for earlier period use would make sense, but my much lighter and smaller maille shirt might work, as I mentionned. It goes down to a little below the waist and has 3 / 4 length sleeves.
Plate alone or maille alone each has it's advantages and are relatively easy to put on without assistance.
Both together seems to multiply any problems unless fit and adjustments are just about perfect including thickness of Gambison being factored in.
Couldn't resits the temptation to try everything on.

Anton;
Thanks for the kind words. With some adjustment of the maille sleeves: Pulling them up to create some slack mobility might be a bit better. Up to that locked up feeling at 90 degrees the arms seemed reasonnably mobile but don't expect to be able to scratch between your own shoulder blades.

[Joseph C.]

Now, but that helmet on tight and go try fighting! ... You'll find a new appreciation for oxygen. (Your body will acclimate after a couple of months.)

[Jean Thibodeau]

Joseph;

Yes and that is why I like my Albion Cervelière or even better my Valentine Armoury Eyeslot Kettle Hat ; With those at least AIR is not a problem compared to my cheap " Sugarloaf Great Helm " with the tiny breath holes. ( For display only. )

Now the Kettle hat can be worn by itself with a big bubble of air inside using only the light built in suspension.

Now if I add the Linen arming coif plus Maille coif heat does seem to accumulate under the hat.

Bare headed and with a few major body parts uncovered like the legs, heat dissipation seems not too bad, when fully covered head to foot it does seem a challenge not to pass out. ( Hey I live with minus 20 / 40 celsius winters, so I can take cold easier than heat, although our summers in Montreal can at times be very hot and humid. )

Thanks everyone for the input and good advice. Personal experience wearing these is very different from just reading about it or looking at Movies: Sort of make you feel for film actors or stunt people who may have to spend 15 hours days wearing armour or any other hot costumes. I guess you could expand that list to historical warriors and current users of stifling equipment in hot environment: Military, police, firefighters.

[Jean Thibodeau]

Just out of curiousity I am at this moment trying on the plate armour over my old stainless spring steel shirt over a thin teeshirt and everything fits.

To be really at the opposite extreme the leg armour is over a pair of summer shorts: Oh, cool steel over skin
Would probably regret this real fast in the hot Sun I'm sure and a lot of body sweat is probably not the best thing for the steel. ( Will have to get a bit of car wax to protect the steel. )

This smaller maille shirt won't fit over the Gambison as it only fits over a thin teeshirt.

So either I need a thinner Gambison or use my Gambison without my maille shirt as the plate armour fits over it but not both.

Or I would need a larger size of armour parts.

Anyway, getting away from extremes, some thin underarmour garments + my small mail shirt + plate armour works.

With my Gambison the full Hauberk works + a few select parts of the plate can also work but maybe I can consider that I have two separate sets of armour.

With the plate a lot of padding can be optional at least for costume use and with the Hauberk the thicker Gambison gives needed protection against blunt trauma.

Again with a lot of creative mixing and matching I probably have too many possible options to BORE everyone by describing every possible combination.

Oh, plate armour on for at least one hour now and I am still very comfortable. Same thing when I had my Hauberk on by itself.

Well at least I'm having fun

( Edited a bit later after cleaning the armour: Skin + sweat = VERY FAST RUSTING, so no more wearing without something, even if light, between me and the steel and a little wax and / or oilling the steel before & after using. Oh, not completely insane as I never thought that this was a good idea except as an experiment )

[Gary Venable]

You could also consider something like this from Historic Enterprises:

http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart.php?m...8&c=25
http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart.php?m...0&c=25
http://www.historicenterprises.com/cart.php?m...1&c=25

as a compromise between the two.

[Christian Henry Tobler]

[Lloyd Clark]

Christian beat me to that as I was sure that 14th century plate armours were worn over hauberks.

Jean, as for the heat, I have spent extended periods of time in my armour in over 100 degree heat - didn't like it and I am sure that there are two or three lakes that still haven't recovered the water I drank, but you can get used to it. One note though, make sure that your gambeson and undergarments are of natural material - polyfill, etc. increases your heat exponentially (at least it felt that way to me ). Another trick is to keep your helm either off or open for as long as possible to let the heat out and air in.

Welcome to the club!

[Patrick Kelly]

I spent a lot of time in armor in southern California, Nevada, and New Mexico. Kinda felt like Outremer at times.


I pretty much agree with the points everyone have already made. Arming clothes made of natural materials are a must, as is drinking lots of water. I wore a great helm for exactly one event. After that it was an open faced sallet for me. One of the biggest things is to remember to breath. When you're in those excitable situations you may find that you're holding your breath. That makes it easy to stroke out when the ambient temperature is already near a 100 degrees.

Ah memories.

[Jean Thibodeau]

Thanks everyone for the helpful information and encouragement and for laughing with me and NOT AT me

So, I guess if one expects to be dripping hot from the start and just gets used to it it's do-able.

Oh, I do have the Revival Enterprises Gambison and it is as comfortable and as "cool " as one could expect.
Don't want to wash it everytime I wear it though as " Clean Sweat " does seem to evaporate without leaving a bad odour so far: Keeping in mind that it didn't get sopping wet during these limlted tests.
The one unfortunate thing is that the armour does leave dirty looking " Oil ? " residue making it look dirtier that it really is.
I guess that just makes it looked used I guess ? Oil and / or rust stains must have been impossible to avoid ?

Lloyd: Heat and getting air is why I like my Kettle hat, as I mentioned before and taking of your helm as much as possible helps a lot as we loose a lot of heat from the head. ( Cold winters prove that )

An indepth feature article about the pitfalls and proper techniques for wearing and adjusting armour to the body might be a good subject to feature !

Well off to do more tests: It gets easier as every attempt teaches me something.

( Hint, Hint: Nathan if you are looking for ideas for features ) ( NOT by me, but by those with experience )