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Andrew Gill





Joined: 19 Feb 2015

Posts: 150

PostPosted: Mon 05 Feb, 2018 5:26 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Michael

Making holes in the polearm head or shaft will actually be counterproductive - you are actually increasing the surface area, which will increase drag, as well as the disruption of the flow patterns around the shaft. However, that gives me an idea:

What you might get away with is dimpling the shaft like a golfball - this trips the flow to turbulent, which for a cylinder or a sphere allows you to avoid the laminar-flow separation nastiness (usually, going to turbulent flow would increase the drag; round objects like golf balls under certain flow conditions are a special case, btw). Actually, small studs (eg. small copper nails with dome-heads protruding or tiny barnacles) would probably also work. This can reduce the drag to roughly a quarter of that of a smooth cylinder, without seriously weakening the pole (another problem with holes through the shaft is that they'll weaken it drastically - holes are known as "stress-concentrators" in structural engineering) and, best of all, this is achievable using very primitive technology and tools.
So your best bet is probably eliptical-cross-section dimpled (or studded) polearms. Short is still better than long, though, because of the velocity-squared term. So a long polearm might be the sign of a very strong (or very inexperienced) warrior in your world.
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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 487

PostPosted: Mon 05 Feb, 2018 6:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Million dollar response there! Thanks for the dimpling idea.
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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 487

PostPosted: Tue 06 Feb, 2018 8:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ok so linear movements for polearms are the most hydrodynamic attacks, but slices can be done this way as well. So I want to get together as many kinds of polearms as possible.

Spears-obviously the most common and straightforward.
Trident-why stab someone once when you can stab them three times. Also it can block a spear with the cross, hook with the tines, possibly wind around a blocking spear.

Spiedo/ranseur- spear with two backward hooks. They can be lined with teeth to make for a murderous hooking attacks that did into flesh, same block with cross as the tridents.

Pollaxe- since swings are less effective and the hammer and spike are more anti plate armor, this weapon is out.

Naginata/glaive- slicing at distance can be very lethal, especially with a deeply hooked shark tooth blade. The most powerful hews would be impossible for such a long haft, but perhaps would allow for drive by attacks where the blade is held out and the user swims past.

More will be added later.

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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 487

PostPosted: Wed 07 Feb, 2018 3:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Polearm evaluation continued

Nagamaki/falx- A ranged slashing polearm is a good niche to fill, and especially with a very hooked sharktooth blade, it can be used to grab as well as slash. Since a swinging attack through water is very inefficient for polearms, I think that only short polearms like nagamaki and falx will work. Between the dimpled surface and two-handed lever, the power increase should be worth the increase in drag.

Naginata/glaive- An even longer slashing polearm is probably unable to perform cuts at all. Although it is perhaps possible to stick the weapon out and perform a swim-by attack. That said, the shorter version fo each of these could also do that by holding them further down the handle and without the extra associated penalties. Naginata out.

Pike- The pike would be an excellent weapon underwater. Used at speed it will work just like a two-handed lance. Since underwater creatures are the only animals that actually have spears in real life (marlins, swordfish), this seems very viable. The length of the shaft won't matter since pikes are only used in linear thrusting attacks, and without other ranged weapons, the pike will be even more powerful than it was in history.

Long trident- A pike can't actually defend without bringing its point offline, but a long trident can use the cross to block and then can wind its point around again. Without a cavalry equivalent (all combat is just fast infantry), the pike block seems a very natural tactic to adopt under water.

Anything that I'm missing?

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Andrew Gill





Joined: 19 Feb 2015

Posts: 150

PostPosted: Wed 07 Feb, 2018 4:59 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Michael

That sounds pretty good! I have one more polearm to suggest: what about bardiches or lochaber axes? A long, heavy curved axe-like blade bound onto a short pole, but extending far past it, ending in a wicked stabbing point, and optionally with a hook behind. The blade length increases reach without increasing drag too badly, as it is slender. Granted, this is less than straightforward without metal, though not impossible in bone, either cracked and sharpened, or perhaps even using part of some monstrous sea-creature's jaw with some of the teeth still attached (or magically reinforced stone, if you want to go the Steven Ericson route - probably not) I suppose with stone-age tech, there would be a functional grey area between this and a glaive or falx, depending on the length.
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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 487

PostPosted: Wed 07 Feb, 2018 3:11 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Yeah, not sure how it would differ from a falx. A hook on the back maybe? Baaically a two handed khopesh. Sounds good.
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