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Martin Wallgren
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 Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2012 3:14 pm Post subject: Weird Segmentata armour (split from Javelins with fletching) |
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I was linked to this french forum by a friend... http://mediaephile.com/forum/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1219063763 ... where I found the images.
obj 00074028,T:
Frankreich, Des cas des nobles hommes et femmes, 1458, Handschrift, München, Bayerische Staatsbibliothek.
Fouquet, Jean, Buchausstattung.
Antiochus III., König von Syrien, Miniatur (in der Kolumne)
Inventar-Nr. Cod. gall. 6
Swordsman, Archer and Dad
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Luka Borscak
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| Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2012 3:40 pm Post subject: |
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I think my brain will force me to have a replica of this. if only there was a surviving example of this... Any idea how this would be constructed?
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Randall Moffett
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| Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2012 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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I think he is one of PJs elves.....
Maybe it is textile armour? I cannot imagine it'd work very well over other armour of this time.
RPM
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Nat Lamb
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| Posted: Tue 30 Oct, 2012 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Very reminiscent of the Elve's armour in LotR, particularly the ones with the "nagamaki" like polearm/swords in the battle scene at the start
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William P
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| Posted: Wed 31 Oct, 2012 12:55 am Post subject: |
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Well in the movie, that armour was done in one piece, It might be worth considering that because it looks segmented doesnt neccesarily mean the plates slip and slide etc. It might be just a funny way of presenting a more rigid piece of armour.
If it does move, I am willing to bet the plates are mostely attatched to each other in the middle, when you bend, the plates can slide freely and are probab;y partly attatched to each other by leathers not unlike the negmentata.
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Jeffrey Hildebrandt
Industry Professional
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| Posted: Wed 31 Oct, 2012 6:41 am Post subject: |
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Considering that the image depicts Antiochus III, the King of Syria, I think that there is a distinct possibility that some of the armour depicted is fanciful, even if the majority of it was contemporary. Note the style of spaulders that the king is wearing - it is a conventional depiction of antique armour, used on ancients, angels, etc. It is also possible that the segmented armour was actually intended to depict a Roman lorica segmentata, considering that Antiochus was defeated by Rome in 192 BC.
Royal Oak Armoury Website
Royal Oak Armoury Facebook
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Matthew Amt
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| Posted: Wed 31 Oct, 2012 9:44 am Post subject: |
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| Jeffrey Hildebrandt wrote: | | Considering that the image depicts Antiochus III, the King of Syria, I think that there is a distinct possibility that some of the armour depicted is fanciful, even if the majority of it was contemporary. Note the style of spaulders that the king is wearing - it is a conventional depiction of antique armour, used on ancients, angels, etc. It is also possible that the segmented armour was actually intended to depict a Roman lorica segmentata, considering that Antiochus was defeated by Rome in 192 BC. |
Bingo. It's a deliberate "archaism" to represent a soldier from ancient times. The king looks a little neo-Classical as well.
Matthew
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Mart Shearer
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Mart Shearer
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Johan Gemvik
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| Posted: Mon 03 Dec, 2012 9:39 am Post subject: |
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Could this be lmprovised armour from rolled cloth? If you had cloth but no time or skilled tailor around to make a proper jack from it?
"The Dwarf sees farther than the Giant when he has the giant's shoulder to mount on" -Coleridge
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Luka Borscak
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| Posted: Mon 03 Dec, 2012 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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Could be. But all these examples look very different to me than the first one that started the thread and looks too precise geometrically to be textile armor.
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Michael Ekelmann
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| Posted: Sat 08 Dec, 2012 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Matthew Amt wrote: | | Jeffrey Hildebrandt wrote: | | Considering that the image depicts Antiochus III, the King of Syria, I think that there is a distinct possibility that some of the armour depicted is fanciful, even if the majority of it was contemporary. Note the style of spaulders that the king is wearing - it is a conventional depiction of antique armour, used on ancients, angels, etc. It is also possible that the segmented armour was actually intended to depict a Roman lorica segmentata, considering that Antiochus was defeated by Rome in 192 BC. |
Bingo. It's a deliberate "archaism" to represent a soldier from ancient times. The king looks a little neo-Classical as well.
Matthew |
Another vote for deliberate classicism. Given that the subjects illustrated are all from classical antiquity, I would say the artist is attempting to depict a lorica segmenta from descriptions he's read in surviving copies of classical texts or maybe was just told "In the old days they wore armour made of bands, draw something like that."
It's like a historian 600 years in the future trying to reconstruct French 17th century military uniforms and equipment from an illustrated Alexandre Dumas book published in the 1950s.
That isn't to say that I would frown on a reconstruction of the armour depicted in the manuscript. I'm pretty keen on making a kit modeled after some of the 14th cent Italian paintings/frescoes of antiquity. A coat of plates that looks like a linothorax or spolas? How cool is that!
“Men prefer to fight with swords, so they can see each other's eyes!" Sean Connery as Mulay Hamid El Raisuli in The Wind and the Lion
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This is a standard topic
