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Zlatko Vlašic




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Feb 2007

Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun 14 Nov, 2010 8:14 am    Post subject: New sword - peened or threaded pommel?         Reply with quote

I am buying a new sword and cannot decide between these two

Cold Steel - Italian Long sword

http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=...Long+Sword

Hanwei - Albrech II Hand and a half

http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=...Half+Sword

I am leaning more to the Hanwei, overall I like this blade type better, however I am worried that the Hanwei has a peened pommel (Italian long sword is threaded), and I would much prefer threaded pommel.

Now this is relevant because I am completely useless with any kind of tools or DIY stuff - I tend to injure myself or other while attempting basic fixes:). It seems to me that if anything goes wrong with the Hanwei hilt, being peened there is very little I can do about it. On the other hand, with a threaded pommel I can at least retighten it or dissassemble and attempt to do something, however basic.

So how realistic are my fears? How likely is it that a peened pommel with start giving me problems considering light cutting use, on this particular model? Does anybody own this Hanwei model - if yes, have you experienced any problems with the hilt?

Thanks,
Zlatko

"To you, Baldrick, Renaissance is just something that happened to other people."

Edmund Blackadder
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Joel Chesser




Location: Oklahoma
Joined: 23 Oct 2003

Posts: 715

PostPosted: Sun 14 Nov, 2010 8:42 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I can't speak for the Cold steel, but I have owned the Hanwei Sword and really liked it. It is one I would not mind owning agan. As for repairs, if the sword is treated well i kind of doubt the peen will just come loose. If it does following the very simple steps here: http://bjorn.foxtail.nu/swords.htm should solve your problems.
..." The person who dosen't have a sword should sell his coat and buy one."

- Luke 22:36
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Michael B.
Industry Professional



Location: Seattle, WA
Joined: 18 Oct 2007

Posts: 362

PostPosted: Sun 14 Nov, 2010 7:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Cold Steel one will probably have an all thread piece welded onto to the tang, then have the pommel drilled through with a cap bolt that is epoxied on. Once you break the epoxy, it unscrews and you are able to dismount the furniture. The handle is also mostly epoxy. Once everything is stripped, you may want a blade smith to redo the tang. I have friends with both weapons, the Hanwei if I remember correctly is peened.
www.facebook.com/bearmountainforge2
Michael Bergstrom
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Likes: 7 pages

Posts: 2,278

PostPosted: Mon 15 Nov, 2010 12:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

New Cold Steel Italian Longsword supposedly has a nut similar to that of ATrim swords...
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Zlatko Vlašic




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Feb 2007

Posts: 32

PostPosted: Mon 15 Nov, 2010 11:18 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luka Borscak wrote:
New Cold Steel Italian Longsword supposedly has a nut similar to that of ATrim swords...


Is that good or bad? Confused

I guess good, considering the reputation and quality of ATrim...

"To you, Baldrick, Renaissance is just something that happened to other people."

Edmund Blackadder
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Joel Chesser




Location: Oklahoma
Joined: 23 Oct 2003

Posts: 715

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 12:18 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

KOA says it has a pommel nut, though based on the pictures of it on their site it doesn't look anything like an Atrim pommel nut. Those, according to my understanding can be taken apart with a hex wrench, this does not look like that at all.
..." The person who dosen't have a sword should sell his coat and buy one."

- Luke 22:36
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Likes: 7 pages

Posts: 2,278

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 1:03 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Zlatko Vlašic wrote:
Luka Borscak wrote:
New Cold Steel Italian Longsword supposedly has a nut similar to that of ATrim swords...


Is that good or bad? Confused

I guess good, considering the reputation and quality of ATrim...


It would be good, but obviously it isn't exactly like ATrim... maybe something similar...
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Tom Kinder





Joined: 27 Nov 2008

Posts: 148

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 5:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Luka Borscak wrote:
Zlatko Vlašic wrote:
Luka Borscak wrote:
New Cold Steel Italian Longsword supposedly has a nut similar to that of ATrim swords...


Is that good or bad? Confused

I guess good, considering the reputation and quality of ATrim...


It would be good, but obviously it isn't exactly like ATrim... maybe something similar...


Gus used to use a cap nut kind of thing that had to be taken on and off with vice grips, I think this older nut system is what is being compared to.

incidently I think Gus is considering going back to the old nut. at least that's the way he was talking a little while ago but I haven't seen it happen yet . . .
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Jonathan Blair




Location: Hanover, PA
Joined: 15 Aug 2005
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PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 5:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Why would you need to disassemble the hilt? To clean it? Why would you need to clean the tang? To repair it? You've already said you have no inclination for mechanical talent. Having a threaded pommel just invites loosened hilt components. Sure you can tighten them, but it would be an ongoing thing. Could you imagine this during a real fight? "Excuse me, but my pommel is rattling. Let me get my allen wrench and tighten it. Hold on. There, that's better. Now, where were we? Wait, are those my guts on the floor? When did that happen?"

A peened pommel seems to be the 99% norm for swords from the time frame represented by the two swords. If it were well made, nothing would rattle or come loose. I have a Del Tin 2130 with peened pommel that is seventeen years old and it is still as tight as the day I bought it. The Windlass Knightly Hand and a Half sword with its threaded pommel nut I have issues with all the time with rattling and loosening.

Edited because of a horrid spelling error and to clarify with underlined text.

"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." - The Lord Jesus Christ, from The Gospel According to Saint Matthew, chapter x, verse 34, Authorized Version of 1611


Last edited by Jonathan Blair on Tue 16 Nov, 2010 10:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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Zlatko Vlašic




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Feb 2007

Posts: 32

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 6:04 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan Blair wrote:
Why would you need to disassemble the hilt? To clean it? Why would you need to clean the tang? To repair it? You've already said you have no inclination for mechanical talent. Having a threaded pommel just invites loosened hilt components.


To repair it - I can't do it personally, but I can get my brother to help and he's much more tech savvy.
Also, maybe eventually I can commision an upgrade of the sword with better leatherwork on the grip, if I find somebody able to the work where I live. Seems that having a threaded pommel would greatly facilitate that. I'm not really sure I would ever decide to dissassemble a sword that is peened, be it for repair or upgrade.

Quote:
A peened pommel seems to be the 99% norm for swords from the time frame represented by the two swords. If it were well made, nothing wourl rattle or come loose. I have a Del Tin 2130 that is seventeen years old and it is still as tight as the day I bought it. The Windlass Knightly Hand and a Half sword with its pommel nut I have issues with all the time with rattling and loosening.


OK, this is very encouraging then:).

@ Joel
Italian longsword can be taken apart - owner of this piece did it for his review, pictures included
http://forum.sword-buyers-guide.com/viewtopic...p;start=10

"To you, Baldrick, Renaissance is just something that happened to other people."

Edmund Blackadder
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
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Posts: 2,278

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 8:08 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This guy will customize your hilt any way you want and he will have no problems with grinding off the peen, doing the job with the hilt components and then peen it again. He did it a few times for me, and he also made me some nice completely new, not just customized fittings.
http://www.top-kristo.hr/
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Jonathan Blair




Location: Hanover, PA
Joined: 15 Aug 2005
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Reading list: 2 books

Posts: 482

PostPosted: Tue 16 Nov, 2010 10:01 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Zlatko Vlašic wrote:
To repair it - I can't do it personally, but I can get my brother to help and he's much more tech savvy.
Also, maybe eventually I can commision an upgrade of the sword with better leatherwork on the grip, if I find somebody able to the work where I live. Seems that having a threaded pommel would greatly facilitate that. I'm not really sure I would ever decide to dissassemble a sword that is peened, be it for repair or upgrade.


What would break in the hilt that would need repair? Under normal use, the steel cross and pommel won't break, neither will the grip, especially when covered with leather or wire. Leather wraps are best served not going between the material of the grip (wood, bone, etc) and the cross or pommel as that is a source of rattling. My Albion does not have the leather between the grip and the steel hilt components: it lays on top of the grip.

Zlatko Vlašic wrote:
OK, this is very encouraging then:).


I'm not sure what is so encouraging. My Del Tin has a peened pommel, whereas my Windlass has a threaded pommel. Sounds less than encouraging if you have your heart set on the threaded pommel, at least to me.

In the end, get the sword you want to get because you like the design or the historical period of the sword, not because the ease of disassembly of the hilt. You'll be much happier with your purchase then.

"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." - The Lord Jesus Christ, from The Gospel According to Saint Matthew, chapter x, verse 34, Authorized Version of 1611
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