Baskethilts from the Wars of three Kingdoms to Killiecrankie -- myArmoury.com

Luka Borscak

Hello! I'm a total newbie to baskethilts and Scottish history later than 14th or 15th century so I need a great deal of help. Happy

I'm interested in ordering a custom basket that would fit in period I'm researching at the moment, from the Wars of the three Kingdoms to early Jacobite rising and the battle of Killiecrankie. I love the simple looks of the ribbon baskethilt in this topic: http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=17465 but I have no idea in what years such basket would be popular. If it doesn't fit into early years of "my" period, 40's or 50's of 17th century I would be most thankful for some pictures of simple baskets of that period. I would love to read some books on typology of baskethilts but at the moment I really don't have the money to order expensive books from abroad.
I should also say that the smith who will probably make a basket for me is from my country, Croatia, and he never made a scottish baskethilt so I need many pictures to lead him through the work. And just one more question... Wink

I'll probably order a Del Tin blade for that project and I would appreciate advice on which blade to order for the said period. Either single edged or double edged. Multiple fullers prefered. Wink

I hope I'm not getting on your nerves too much, I'm very thankful in advance. Happy

Neal Matheson · Posted: Sun 13 Sep, 2009 7:59 am Post subject:

I've lent my wallace book out to someone which is a bit of a pain. I think a ribbon hilt would be fine for this project. Single or double edge swords are both fine. Del tin blades are very popular but in my experience have been dreadfully heavy. Armour class do excellent quality blades with a very decent weight.

Justin King · Industry Professional

If your interest is in the Highland types, I think the ribbon hilts probably fit your period best. If your leanings are more toward Lowland and English styles then the early "Irish" style, the Twysden style and perhaps the SW11 style are good examples. Most of the later styles which are regarded as distinctly Scottish seem to have their origins in the 2nd half of the 17th, so your period may encompass a few of these, but mostly the earlier styles.
Wallace remarked that blades from the 17th century seem to have been almost exclusively double edged, although the late 16th century English styles seem to have favored backsword blades, and in the18th both types were commonly used.

A simple example of the basic "Twysden" style, the "Irish" style is similar in the basic layout of the elements but the bars are usually of more oval or semi-circular section- http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....mp;pos=104
An example of what is sometimes called the "Irish" style- http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....mp;pos=125
The SW11 example- http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....amp;pos=17
An somewhat unusual example from your period- http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....amp;pos=75
Another example that is somewhat unusual but one of my favorites- http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....mp;pos=217
This thread shows a picture of the actual Twysden sword. which is heavily decorated- http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t...ht=twysden

Henrik Bjoern Boegh · Posted: Sun 13 Sep, 2009 11:24 am Post subject:

The ribbon hilts are excellent choises. The beak nosed style would probably not be around before 1650, from what I understand, but the earlier ones with countercurved quillons would be perfect for the time.

Broadswords were more common, but there are ribbon hilts from this period with backsword blades as well.

Cheers,
Henrik

Luka Borscak · Posted: Sun 13 Sep, 2009 4:37 pm Post subject:

I think I'm going with the ribbon hilt. So, swords like these in the links below would be good for 1650+: http://www.themadpiper.com/images/sw4l.jpg
http://www.myArmoury.com/view.html?reviews/madp_ribbon_a.jpg

And for period 1600-1650 these?
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....fullsize=1
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....fullsize=1
http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....fullsize=1 (low right one)

I like these with short counter curved quillons more than long ones.

What is the hilt construction for 17th century baskethilts? Peened or screwed?

P.S. I'm discovering a whole new world and I'm loving it. Wink

Henrik Bjoern Boegh · Posted: Mon 14 Sep, 2009 5:10 am Post subject:

You've got it right, Luka! Happy

Screwed would be right.

Cheers,
Henrik

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 5:35 am Post subject:

Nice. I think I will concentrate on this one: http://www.myArmoury.com/albums/displayimage....fullsize=1 with DT6150 blade http://www.deltin.net/6150.htm (Armour class is not available to me, I only buy blades available in local shop, it's cheaper and I can handle them before buying.)
Thanks guys! Any secrets about making a basket or some more pictures would ofc be much appreciated. Wink

Gabriele Becattini · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 8:39 am Post subject:

Hi Luka,

i have an armour class basket hilt with a DT6150 blade, the blade itself it's quite heavy, it looks nice for a basket like the one you have in mind but paid attention to the balance, especially if you are going with a smith with no experience about basket hilt, my sword handle quite well but you need a trained arm for using it, if you are new about the handling of a basket hilt and if you have planned to use it for fencing or living history are all things that you have to consider.

have fun with your project, i'm curious to see the result, it could be very interesting to discover a new basket maker not so far from italy.

cheers

gabriele

Barry C. Hutchins · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 11:52 am Post subject:

Here is Vince Evans' step by step construction of a basket hilt:

http://www.picturetrail.com/sfx/album/view/829655

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 1:07 pm Post subject:

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 1:10 pm Post subject:

Barry C. Hutchins · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 1:52 pm Post subject:

Try this link to start, it should get you to the step by step section

http://www.picturetrail.com/sfx/album/listing/user/vevans

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 2:40 pm Post subject:

I had to register to see the pictures. Now it's ok.

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 15 Sep, 2009 4:17 pm Post subject:

Luka Borscak · Posted: Sun 20 Sep, 2009 4:34 am Post subject:

Gabriele Becattini · Posted: Sun 20 Sep, 2009 4:55 am Post subject:

peening is enterely correct for the early 1600s, the price that your smith has asked you is very low considering that is a custom work, i'm eager to see the result.

cheers

gabriele

Luka Borscak · Posted: Tue 22 Sep, 2009 4:52 pm Post subject:

Yep, it's really cheap. What do you guys think about this blade for this project? I like double fullers: http://minishop.t-com.hr/replikart/ProductDet...amp;gid=72

Edit: The photo of the sword is no longer visible on the link I posted. It is discontinued Windlass Sword of Granson, I have an opportunity to buy it for a relatively low price.

Mark Millman · **On Tuesday 15 September 2009, you wrote:**

Dear Mr. Borscak,

Luka Borscak · Posted: Wed 23 Sep, 2009 11:53 am Post subject:

Wow, interesting threads with some beautiful weapons pictured. Thanks Mr. Millman.

Henrik Bjoern Boegh · Posted: Thu 01 Oct, 2009 3:10 am Post subject:

Thanks for the description, Mark.

The basket hilt I've got by Eljay is made the same way as the kilji bladed sword in one of the posts you've shown.

I noticed the same type of nut on many swords while I was in Scotland recently, but on some of the earlier ones (from late 16th to early mid 17th century) I saw simply peened tangs. Sorry, no photos. But if ever you go to Scotland visit Blair Castle in Blair Atholl. Amazing collection from late 16th century to 19th century basket hilts. Many, many loooooverrrrrly basket hilts there.

Cheers,
Henrik