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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 10:28 am

Robin Smith wrote:

Mr. Johnsson is there any hope for a bigger example of a type X down the road anywhere? I love the design shared for the Reeve/Bayeux/Stamford. So much so, that in addition to the Reeve I have already ordered, I will also get a Stamford once they are available despite the duplicate blade.
However, all of those are on the small end of the historical type X's, you have said as much yourself in earlier threads. It would be great to see some of the dynamic principles you applied in the making of Patrick Kelly's "Big Johnnson" put to use on a NG type X. A real shield splitter moreso than a leg biter, if you get my meaning...

respectfully,

I see what you mean with a shield splitter. :)
You know I like those myself.
I am not sure when that could be fitted into the plan of things for the NG line. There is quite a bit on the to-do list already as it is...
I am not saying it is not possible, only that I cannot see it on the horizon right now.
A revisiting of the Templar could fit your need perhaps? If so, it is a thing that might happen within the forseeable future.

The first NG vikings are going to be revisited and in that process: I´ll look over the blades. If I do a redesign of the blades the goal will be to make them even more clearly viking period in style and even less generic. This will prohibit their use in later period type X swords. Transitional period might work however.
Perhaps one of these can fit your interest in a shield splitter, and possibly that blade could be used for a transitional tea cosy hilt.

I can see a reason to revisit type Xa, XI, XIa and XII but this will also have to be weighed against the need to expand the Maestro line and expanding the NG line into so far unrepresented eras and types.

There are so many swords waiting to be studied and celebrated!
:D

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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 11:24 am

Grayson C. wrote:

....
Any plans for another sword with a cocked hat pommel? I own the Ritter and it is the pride and joy of my collection. I know that these swords are not really popular, but I for one can't get enough. Hopefully we can see more?
...

Personally I´d love to make another cocked hat pommel. I would like to see one on a smaller sword than the Ritter. I cannot say if it is going to happen, though. ...I really like the thought :)

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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 11:32 am

Jonathan Blair wrote:

Are there any new hand and a halfers in the works? The type XIIa and XVIa blades are seriously underused in the Next Generation lineup. I'd love to see these two coupled with other crosses and pommels in keeping with their respective time periods. Also, is there any plan to offer additional Squire Line swords or Museum Line swords? I know the Museum Line was targeting one to two pieces a year, the last being the SoSM, but for the Squire Line, it's almost like they've been forgotten in light of their Next Generation brethren. It would be great to see a few more diverse offerings in the Squire Line for those of us who are on a budget.

No immediate plans for hand and half swords, other than we naturally will add more later on.
Presently the focus is to complete the ones that has been waitng for their turn quite a while now.
Apart from these there are some other projects that has been evolving and will be presented in due time.
The Maestro line needs attention, as does the Squire line.

I would love to design another type XIIa as well as an alternative XVIa. I would also love to see a broad and thin type XXII in large war sword size and we have the much needed type XIII.
So, you see even if the XIIa and XVIa are not as varied and numerous as they could be, there are still other swords to explore as well.
I feel pretty sure we will make other type XIIa, XVIa when the tiem has come to start anew adding fresh models.
I have a definite vision of a XIIa blade I would like to see in the NG line. The Baron was one of the first swords we did. I would love to make use of the capabilities we have developed by developing a completely new l13th C war sword of type XIIa.

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Posts: 223 Location: NCF, Sarasota, FL

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 11:53 am

Peter Johnsson wrote:

Grayson C. wrote:

....
Any plans for another sword with a cocked hat pommel? I own the Ritter and it is the pride and joy of my collection. I know that these swords are not really popular, but I for one can't get enough. Hopefully we can see more?
...

Personally I´d love to make another cocked hat pommel. I would like to see one on a smaller sword than the Ritter. I cannot say if it is going to happen, though. ...I really like the thought :)

Well I'd snap it up in an instance. Come to think of it, a smaller blade (maybe a type X...XIa...small type XII even?) would look positively outstanding. Wow I'm getting chills thinking about that! Are there many historical swords like this?

Hope you decide to make a design like this, you'd be making me really happy :lol:

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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:08 pm

Jeremiah Swanger wrote:

Peter Johnsson wrote:

They are really something else: antennae pommels and single edged blades. Something out of a fantasy movie, almost.

Um... "Antennae" pommels? Can someone think of a good example, as I don't seem to be familiar with these...?

This is a quick "concept" sketch of what they can look like.
To me they are the epitome of Ugly-cute in swords.

Quote from "IX-XIII a. Baltu Kalavijai" by Vytautas Kazakevicius (Thank you Nathat for this great book!)
"Antennal
These swords have a purely local form, found only in Latvia and Lithuania. They are single edged, the blade is 72-82 cm long, 2,6 - 4 cm wide, and the back is up to 0.7 cm thick. Their hilts have no pommels, only upper cross bars with the tips curved upwards and bowed. The lower cross bars are long and narroww or of medium width, curved downwards, or occasionally straight.
....
Thus antennal swords were used at the end of the 10th -11th century and should be regarded as a scarce sword type wich was undoubtedly invented and produced by Baltic weaponsmiths."

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Please note that this drawing is not taken from the book, nor is it an exact rendering of any one specific sword in the book.

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Posts: 2,167

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:20 pm

Peter Johnsson wrote:

Personally I´d love to make another cocked hat pommel. I would like to see one on a smaller sword than the Ritter. I cannot say if it is going to happen, though. ...I really like the thought :)

Hey Peter, I've got a suggestion if you are indeed interested in making another sword with a cocked hat pommel. While I like the Ritter for being a high end sword with a cocked hat pommel, the actual shape of the pommel looks "wrong" to me. All of the antique swords that I have seen with the hat seem to be much more rounded, wide and fat in appearance. An excellent example of this is the sword that inspired the Ritter: http://www.albion-swords.com/swords/albion/ne...ations.htm . The pommel on that one seems to be significantly different than the one currently on the Ritter.

I don't mean to imply that the Ritter's pommel is ahistorical in appearance- there might be antique swords with cocked hats which are very similar to the Ritter. However, if you're thinking of revisiting the cocked hat type or pommel, making it wider with more of a "Brazil nut shape" would be definitely cool to see.

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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:26 pm

Grayson C. wrote:

Peter Johnsson wrote:

Grayson C. wrote:

....
Any plans for another sword with a cocked hat pommel? I own the Ritter and it is the pride and joy of my collection. I know that these swords are not really popular, but I for one can't get enough. Hopefully we can see more?
...

Personally I´d love to make another cocked hat pommel. I would like to see one on a smaller sword than the Ritter. I cannot say if it is going to happen, though. ...I really like the thought :)

Well I'd snap it up in an instance. Come to think of it, a smaller blade (maybe a type X...XIa...small type XII even?) would look positively outstanding. Wow I'm getting chills thinking about that! Are there many historical swords like this?

Hope you decide to make a design like this, you'd be making me really happy :lol:

Here is one example of a small and handy sword with cocked hat pommel. I would guess it is a type XII or possibly type XI blade. It is a late 13th C effigy: Freiherrn Ulrich von Regensberg, 1285. The Effigy is in the Landesmuseum in Zürich.

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Last edited by Peter Johnsson on Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Posts: 223 Location: NCF, Sarasota, FL

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:26 pm

Craig,

Maybe a candidate for a museum line represenation?

Alright, that's probably wishful thinking.

I noticed that exact same thing (link is giving trouble by the way) when I was contemplating buying the ritter. The pommel is, as you say, quite a bit different, at least when looked at from the sides. The original has quite a bit more taper, if that term can be applied to a pommel. I'm assuming (by looks alone obviously) that it also has more mass because it looks quite a bit denser than the pommel on the ritter.

Dont get me wrong, the ritter is my favorite sword. Ever. But the original is apparently differnent. However, the description of the ritter clearly states that it was INSPIRED by this sword. That doesn't mean an exact reproduction.

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Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:40 pm

Craig Peters wrote:

...
Hey Peter, I've got a suggestion if you are indeed interested in making another sword with a cocked hat pommel. While I like the Ritter for being a high end sword with a cocked hat pommel, the actual shape of the pommel looks "wrong" to me. All of the antique swords that I have seen with the hat seem to be much more rounded, wide and fat in appearance. An excellent example of this is the sword that inspired the Ritter: http://www.albion-swords.com/swords/albion/ne...tions.htm. The pommel on that one seems to be significantly different than the one currently on the Ritter.

I don't mean to imply that the Ritter's pommel is ahistorical in appearance- there might be antique swords with cocked hats which are very similar to the Ritter. However, if you're thinking of revisiting the cocked hat type or pommel, making it wider with more of a "Brazil nut shape" would be definitely cool to see.

Hey Craig,

You simply won´t give up will you? ;)

I have tried to describe what I´ve seen when examining actual examples of these pommels: they are much more crispy defined than comes across in photos in books. Even in real life, they are often worn down by time so that lines and planes are blurred today.
Originally they often had distinctly defined planes and visible lines dividing the shapes.

The blurred out shape we often see in reproductions today might be historically correct in some cases, but I think the opposite was the common situation: a clearly and crisply sculpted piece of iron work.

I attach a drawing made by Alfred Geibig in his "Entwicklung des Schwertes im Mittelalter".
He clearly shows what I am trying to get across, marking out the defining lines.
The attached photo is the same sword, but in a blurred out state. My scan makes it look even more blurry. It is still a crisply defined pommel: one of those that has been the basis for the sculpting of the "Ritter".
It might not look right to you, but this is what many, if not most would have looked like when they were new.

Craig, please understand that I do not mean to flame you into submission: Please continue feeling they do not look right. Whatever makes most sense to you.
;)

I don´t want to imply that the Ritter pommel is perfect: another sculpting might yield other results. Returnign to a type or project normally make you see new aspects. The definition of these pommels is one feature that is often lost in replicas today. That is why I feel it is an important thing to explore.
If I get to make another kocked hat pommel for the NG line it will surely be different from the Ritter, simply because it is a good opportunity to explore other options.
Perhaps I manage somehting close to halfway towards your ideal if I really try? ;)

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Last edited by Peter Johnsson on Tue 05 Jun, 2007 1:22 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Posts: 223 Location: NCF, Sarasota, FL

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 12:53 pm

For some good reference shots, just incase. This is from my mini review.

[ Linked Image ]

[ Linked Image ]

[ Linked Image ]

[ Linked Image ]

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Posts: 230 Location: Bolton, UK

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 2:51 pm

Grayson C. wrote:

For some good reference shots, just incase. This is from my mini review.

Greyson, your Ritter is a beautiful sword and I'm glad you posted those pics to remind us what Ritter looks like! ;) :lol:

But seriously, I don't understand why its not a popular style, I think its a very interesting design, and one day, funds permitting, I'd love to own one. If Albion were to produce another cocked hat pommelled sword maybe they could go for one of the earlier, less pronounced designs, married to a type X or Xa blade perhaps? Showing the transition from the brazil nut to the cocked hat.

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Jeremiah Swanger

Posts: 556 Location: Central PA

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 5:07 pm

David Sutton wrote:

Greyson, your Ritter is a beautiful sword and I'm glad you posted those pics to remind us what Ritter looks like! ;) :lol:

But seriously, I don't understand why its not a popular style, I think its a very interesting design, and one day, funds permitting, I'd love to own one. If Albion were to produce another cocked hat pommelled sword maybe they could go for one of the earlier, less pronounced designs, married to a type X or Xa blade perhaps? Showing the transition from the brazil nut to the cocked hat.

I think the Wheeler Type IX, the probable predecessor of the "cocked hat" style pommels, with a curved guard, would look great with a long blade... :cool:

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Posts: 9,547 Location: Dayton, OH

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 5:27 pm

David Sutton wrote:

Greyson, your Ritter is a beautiful sword and I'm glad you posted those pics to remind us what Ritter looks like! ;) :lol:

We have a full page of high quality pics of the Ritter on our Reviews page. There shouldn't be cause to forget what it looks like. :)

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Posts: 746 Location: Louisiana

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 6:15 pm

Peter Johnsson wrote:

A revisiting of the Templar could fit your need perhaps? If so, it is a thing that might happen within the forseeable future.
*snip*
Perhaps one of these can fit your interest in a shield splitter, and possibly that blade could be used for a transitional tea cosy hilt.

Actually, if you combined these two ideas, that would be IMO an awesome sword! A beefy Xa with a tea cozy. Think about it. ;) Thats two birds with one stone, and I think it would be a good compromise.

Peter Johnsson wrote:

I can see a reason to revisit type Xa, XI, XIa and XII but this will also have to be weighed against the need to expand the Maestro line and expanding the NG line into so far unrepresented eras and types.

There are so many swords waiting to be studied and celebrated!
:D

Completely understood. Sometimes my bias for all things early medieval makes me forget they had swords in other periods :lol:
No one does it better than you and the whole Albion team. And for that you have my hearty thanks....

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Posts: 225 Location: Ashburn, VA

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 6:21 pm

Okay, if this is a Peter wish list... I had noticed some posts a year or two ago where you expressed interest, in doing some Eastern European sabers. Would be really cool to see some Rus, Byzantine or Magyar weapons...

Okay, Santa Peter, I know this may not be on the docket, but one can dream!

:cool:

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Posts: 291 Location: NW Ark

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 6:41 pm

Peter Johnsson wrote:

Jeremiah Swanger wrote:

Peter Johnsson wrote:

They are really something else: antennae pommels and single edged blades. Something out of a fantasy movie, almost.

Um... "Antennae" pommels? Can someone think of a good example, as I don't seem to be familiar with these...?

This is a quick "concept" sketch of what they can look like.
To me they are the epitome of Ugly-cute in swords.

Quote from "IX-XIII a. Baltu Kalavijai" by Vytautas Kazakevicius (Thank you Nathat for this great book!)
"Antennal
These swords have a purely local form, found only in Latvia and Lithuania. They are single edged, the blade is 72-82 cm long, 2,6 - 4 cm wide, and the back is up to 0.7 cm thick. Their hilts have no pommels, only upper cross bars with the tips curved upwards and bowed. The lower cross bars are long and narroww or of medium width, curved downwards, or occasionally straight.
....
Thus antennal swords were used at the end of the 10th -11th century and should be regarded as a scarce sword type wich was undoubtedly invented and produced by Baltic weaponsmiths."

Ugly-cute? I really like that turn of phrase. :-)
*That* is an interesting sword!
The antenna pommel is really striking, and has been a personal favorite.

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Posts: 223 Location: NCF, Sarasota, FL

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 7:35 pm

Of course chad, but I thought it would be better to have some images close at hand to the thread. The fact that they were mine over the official reviews is personal choice and shouldn't make any difference. It's of the same sword, just more "grayson-publicity" I guess :lol: .

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Posts: 9,547 Location: Dayton, OH

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 7:38 pm

Grayson C. wrote:

Of course chad, but I thought it would be better to have some images close at hand to the thread. The fact that they were mine over the official reviews is personal choice and shouldn't make any difference. It's of the same sword, just more "grayson-publicity" I guess :lol: .

Just reminding people that loads of info is available on this site, just a few clicks away. :)

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Posts: 1,606 Location: Chicago, Illinois

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 8:15 pm

A revisiting of the Templar would be very cool! I'm posting pics of one of Peter's swords that is my personal favorite, it's the big type Xa (XII,XIII?..hard to tell with the lighting) with the tea cosy pommel and the type 2 cross. I think it would fit the bill of a big shield splitter very well...... Also, what about some other versions based on the Knight?

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Posts: 200

Tue 05 Jun, 2007 9:41 pm

I'd just like to chime in and add my support for another cocked-hat pommel, it's a beautiful form that's seldom recreated and even more seldom executed in such a way to do justice to the original designs... really, I think the Ritter stands alone! I know mine is the current highlight of my collection, and I'd love to be able to add a companion piece. Were you ever to attempt a Museum Line recreation of "The original sword that inspired the Ritter," I think I'd have my order in the day it was announced, whatever the cost.
I'd also really love to see an Oakeshott Type N or O, especially one wedded to a type XII or type XIV blade.
All four of the new designs announced look fantastic to me. I find the Knud especially intriguing, the narrow Xa blade with an AE hilt struck me as being almost a bit incongruous at first, but I've quickly become very excited to see it in the steel.
Great work as always Peter!

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