Posts: 111
Thu 17 Dec, 2020 5:41 am
Behmer type hilt question?
Hey myArmoury,
I’m just wondering if anyone could elaborate as to what behmer type migration era sword hilt number began using different solid metal pieces for its sandwich construction instead of wood or horn, say iron or bronze?
My guess is behmer type 8, 9?
Thanks.
Best regards,
Barrett
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Posts: 130
Thu 17 Dec, 2020 4:31 pm
There are Behmer Type VI examples from Vendel/Valsgarde with this type of construction. See also the Anglo Saxon partial hilt from Fetter Lane (not sure which Behmer type that is off hand, though.)
Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Sun 27 Dec, 2020 12:44 pm
As far as I know, the seemingly solid Vendel swords are actually wood, covered by metal panels.
So as far as Behmer types go, I would for type 9,which is somewhat analogue to Petersen's types A, 1 and 2, and which starts appearing around 700-750.
Posts: 111
Sun 27 Dec, 2020 5:44 pm
Paul,
Thanks so much for the reply. Any way you can link some examples? Been looking, barely found anything.
Best regards,
Barrett Hiebert
Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Mon 28 Dec, 2020 10:48 am
Barrett Hiebert wrote: |
Any way you can link some examples? Been looking, barely found anything.
|
Are you looking for Behmer type 9, or Petersen type A, 1 or 2?
Posts: 111
Mon 28 Dec, 2020 7:10 pm
Paul,
Behmer type 9. Please and thanks.
Best regards,
Barrett Hiebert
Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Tue 29 Dec, 2020 10:40 am
Here you go.
Tafel LXII - LXIV are type IX.
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Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Tue 29 Dec, 2020 10:43 am
Posts: 111
Tue 29 Dec, 2020 11:24 am
Paul,
Thanks for the pictures. Though do you know of any recreations of the behmer type 9 hilt for just before the Viking age? Having trouble finding modern recreations to see clearly without corrosion what the hilts should look like.
Thanks.
Best regards,
Barrett Hiebert
Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Thu 31 Dec, 2020 8:50 am
Well, Patrick Barta's swords 166 and 155 belong to the period immediately before the Viking Age but they are not Behmer Type 9. I'm not familiar with other reproductions of the type.
http://templ.net/english/weapons-antiquity_an...php[/list]
Posts: 589
Tue 05 Jan, 2021 2:30 pm
Paul,
Do you have the providence, dating or the work that lists the first image of your metal hilts that should be classified by Petersen typology?
Another way: do you have any more information about the pieces depicted here
http://myArmoury.com/talk/download.php?id=65888
Posts: 589
Wed 06 Jan, 2021 1:37 pm
Paul--
Thank you. That all metal hilt with the 3 central section grip in that first photo is gorgeous. I want to see it replicated.
Posts: 845 Location: The Netherlands
Wed 06 Jan, 2021 3:33 pm
Kai Lawson wrote: |
Paul--
Thank you. That all metal hilt with the 3 central section grip in that first photo is gorgeous. I want to see it replicated. |
You're welcome!
One thing to remember when looking at photo's from Behmer: they were taken in the 1930's and are as displayed in the musea at that time. In several cases that's good because some swords badly deteriorated in the period around WW2. But also several swords pictured have been later re-assembled in different ways due to evolving understanding of how they must have looked originally.
For instance, some swords are depicted with crossguards, which actually turned out to be scabbard mouths. Or with pommels which turned out to be sword beads. Etc.
The grip of sword Tafel LIII.3b for instance also seems suspicious to me. It may not be a grip at all. So if you would like to have something replicated, you'll need to find more sources than just Behmer, and preferably go to see the sword yourself, see how it is in it's current state and then form your opinion.
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