Hello,

The tonlet armour of Henry VIII is often displayed together with a two-handed sword nearly as tall as the armour itself, yet I can't recall seeing, hearing or reading anything about how two tournament fighters in armour went at each other with these large swords. Are there any texts or images preserved that can show us anything about it?

The Royal Armouries published the following video that shows the armour with the sword, although the way he's moving with the sword in the armour doesn't look entirely right to me : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oi9_FHQVr7g

I'd imagine something more like super-sized half-swording, or perhaps using the sword more like a poleaxe?

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Henry's tonlet harness was made specifically for a tournament on foot. It is not a show of power, rather a rush job after the requirements were changed. Tonlets appear on some other original tournament armours, and they offer great mobility and coverage.

I have no clue about the original question, but am also very interested.

Do not make the mistake of presuming that the unusual elements of sixteenth century armours make them impractical, far from it.
when you where well made 16thC armour for the first time it's quite an eye opener as to how functional odd looking armour can be, especially some of its most unusual elements
There is nothing about this harness that will impede you any more than any other 16thC armour, in fact its designed with 16thC threats in mind, as for using them on a battlefield this particular example is a tournament armour BUT..

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...1514_1.PNG

Its from the Battle of Orsha, and having spent since I was eleven studying 16thC art and the past 15 years wearing many forms of 16thC harness as well as handling antique pieces on occasion I do not believe It to be artistic licence,
Unlike art of other eras the current battles of this time period are usually depicted with extreme realism and only ancient battles and events are shown stylised, what with a few notable artists serving as solders and even acting as a form of war correspondents and writing there own Fechtbuch, rather than having being painted by a 14thC monk or some such.

I'm not able to find the name of the artist right now so I cant prove that he knew what he was doing but
from personal experience of seeing these type of harness in use. I wouldn't bat an eyelid at this picture. and considering the rest of the action in the painting all other equipment is depicted with %100 accuracy and no stylisation of any kind.

As it happens I actually plan to have a harness similar to the ones in this painting made for myself in the near future.

http://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Goliath_(MS_Germ.Quart.2020)

It's not in armor, but the swords are the right size. The armored fighters later in the book use smaller swords.

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These are big swords as well. The text says this though:

Quote:

FORM OF THE SWORD IN ARMOUR The sword for fighting in armour should have the form as written below, thus: it should be of a length to come with the pommel under the arm, sharpened four fingers from the point. It’s handle should be of a span. The crossguard should be as long as the handle of the sword. And it should be pointed on every side. And similarly, the pommel should be pointed, so that you can strike with any of these parts.

From the looks of them, they look kind of like big boar swords in shape (leaf-bladed on the ends) with a pointed cross and pommel. It's not for tournament fighting though... They aren't quite big enough either.

Tonlet armored fighting (wrong swords though):

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Period art can be a real minefield when it comes to properly extracting information from it, as it is often extremely misleading. Written inventories and other records must also be consulted to get a better picture of what really went on. Artists only very rarely had seen an actual field battle, but they had seen tournaments. I have never ceased to be amused by the appearance of 'frogmouth' joustin helms in so many battle scenes, along with other tournament equipment. This example, dated from 1445 and concerning an incident in the Trojan War, shows people fighting in frogmouths... with swords. ;)

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Hmm, no comment? Well, here's an even better example of artistic license. It has me wondering if, such as in the painting of the Battle of Orsha, the fellows in the tonlet armours are shown in tonlet armours to make it clear that they are nobles, who do such things as participate in tournaments, and not ordinary men - at - arms.

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