I just become the owner of a Del Tin 2132 sword. The edge is rather blunt and I like to get a good edge on it.
Is there anyone who good tell me what is the best way to act?

Moved to "historic arms talk" forum. Please read to see why: http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic/163.html

Also, the duplicate post was deleted. Please don't post the same thing in multiple forums. It isn't necessary.

This is a good question. I don't actually know the best course of action. I've found it difficult to make a sword that was originally created as a blunt have the proper blade and edge geometry of a sharpened sword. Simply putting an edge on its isn't really the answer, as it then becomes a sharpened blunt. This ends up being quite a differnet sword than a sword created as a sharpened sword from the beginning. If it's important to you to get an end-product that feels and performs closer to a historically sharp sword, my best advice would be to find a swordsmith that was willing to put an edge on it for you. But, then I'm picky.

I use a big flat file, followed by a coarse stone, then a fine stone, then fine sandpaper and fine steel wool to polish out small scratches. WEAR HEAVY GLOVES OR GAUNTLETS!

A swords cutting edge is designed as part of the overall blade geometry, not as an add-on feature. In this respect Nathan is correct that sharpening a Del Tin will yield less than optimal results.

On the other hand, if you want a sharp sword and a DT is all you've got..........................................................

In the past I've used a smaller file. Not a jewelers file, but not one of those huge wood rasps either. Just something that is easy to control, and won't take too much material off at once.

After I've worked the edge down I'll then dress it with a medium grade Arkansas stone. I used to use fine emery cloth, followed by a polishing compound to polish the edge area. I'm now using grey scotchbrite and oil for this purpose, as recommended to me by Peter Johnsson.

Avoid power tools!

So let me get this straight. When Del Tin changed over from the Krupp steel, they changed more than the metal. They began making swords intended for the needs of re-enactors, with a blade that was more than unsharpened, in fact, it was never intended to be sharpened at all!

My Del Tins all have the Krupp blades, and would seem to be able to take a good edge, should one be place on them.
Prior to reading these posts, I had thought that the new steel was the problem, but couldn't figure out why that was so, if reeanactors like those blades so much (according to what I've read.) One would think that a sword that could withstand the rigors of re-enacting would stand up to anything, but it turns out that it's the actual blade geometry that's the kicker. The chrome/vanadium steel is fine for swords.

I find this disappointing because there are a number of Del Tin swords that I like (2140, especially) that I was thinking about purchasing, but as I want a real sword at a reasonable price, I'll stay away from those "blunts" as someone else described them.

I'll just have to wait for good deals on the used market. I've gotten all of my Del Tins that way. Patience, patience, I guess.

Thank you.

Mike West

No. This is absolutely incorrect. You're not undersatnding. I don't believe we talked at all about the steel. We're not talking about durability. We're not talking about materials.

We're talking about the geometry of the blade and the edge. Of course, any piece of steel will take an edge. Does this mean it resembles the subtle geometry of a historic sword? No.

Del Tin has always made blunt swords. When you put an edge on them, they're sharpened, sure.. but without careful attention, they won't match the geometry of a historically authentic sword.

This has absolutely no relationtion to the quality of the blade, the materials, its heat treat, its durability, or anything like that. It only talks about the geometry of the blade and its edge.

Mike West wrote:

So let me get this straight. When Del Tin changed over from the Krupp steel, they changed more than the metal. They began making swords intended for the needs of re-enactors, with a blade that was more than unsharpened, in fact, it was never intended to be sharpened at all! My Del Tins all have the Krupp blades, and would seem to be able to take a good edge, should one be place on them. Prior to reading these posts, I had thought that the new steel was the problem, but couldn't figure out why that was so, if reeanactors like those blades so much (according to what I've read.) One would think that a sword that could withstand the rigors of re-enacting would stand up to anything, but it turns out that it's the actual blade geometry that's the kicker. The chrome/vanadium steel is fine for swords. I find this disappointing because there are a number of Del Tin swords that I like (2140, especially) that I was thinking about purchasing, but as I want a real sword at a reasonable price, I'll stay away from those "blunts" as someone else described them. I'll just have to wait for good deals on the used market. I've gotten all of my Del Tins that way. Patience, patience, I guess. Thank you. Mike West

I think I did understand that it was the blade geometry, and not the steel. I brought up the steel, durability, and materials because that's what I had thought.

I did realize that all Del Tin swords were made unsharpened, or blunt, but didn't realize that you believe that there is no difference between a blunt Del Tin with the Krupp blade, and the new ones without. That's interesting.

So basically, you feel there is no difference between the Krupp blade, and the Chrome/Vanadium blades? And that, neither blade would be your first choice for a "real", or sword due to the intentions of the makers that the swords remain unsharpened, and used for re-enacting?

If one wants a sword, a real sword that some like to call "battle-ready", then they need to be made with that intent, otherwise, they won't have the needed blade geometry?

Thank you.

Mike West

I have no opinion, or real interest, in the steels used by Del Tin. I personally don't think they're significant in this discussion.

As Patrick said:

Quote:

A swords cutting edge is designed as part of the overall blade geometry, not as an add-on feature. In this respect Nathan is correct that sharpening a Del Tin will yield less than optimal results.

A sword design starts with the edge. The geometry of the blade supports that edge.

The point being made in this topic is a simple one: You can sharpen any sword, but it will not exhibit the same geometry of a historically authentic sword that was created as such from the beginning stages of the design. But, as Patrick says, if you have a blunt sword and want it sharp, there are methods described in this topic to do just that!

What are the practical differences one could expect to see between a sword that had an edge as part of it's original design, and one that was given an edge as a later add-on?

It is (or rather: was) possible to get four grades of edge from Del Tin. The standard 0.7 mm (or so) edge, 1.5-2 mm for "live steel" combat, and 2.5 mm flat edge for reenactment (two styles, 1H & 1H&½), plus sharpened on request. The latter has been discontinued, as Italian law doesn't allow sharp swords without a permit.

Well, since I don't plan on chopping anything, blunt blades are what I look for. The reasons are numerous, but having small children and a nervous wife are the main ones. :D

Can anyone tell me what shops do and don't sell blunt blades? I know that my CASI is blunt, but it isn't advertised that way on their site.

A picture done in paint, just to illustrate what happens when you sharpen a blunt compared with a blade that is sharp to begin with.
You can still cut with it, but it is not optimal.

(I´m sorry about the quality of it all, but it was done in haste.)

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The edge on my Del Tin 2132 is not nearly as blunt as on the drawing of mr. Hörnell.On the ISF I've read that a great deal of the medieval swords were having an edge in the form of an apple-seed. That would give a more durable edge in battle.
So I think that from the basis 0.5mm edge on my deltin there has to be made a decent edge. I have an old (about 200 years) Dutch cavalry saber that have the same "appleseed"edge,
Cor Böhms

Their used to be an essay available online on sharpening Del Tins by a gentleman associated with a South African firm that dealt in them. His method was fairly time-consuming, but what it boiled down to was the "apple-seed".

A common mistake with sword edges is to make the edge bevels too short. In pic I, you have the standard semi-blunt Del Tin edge, in II the rather common "sharp blunt", as Fredrik put it. In III, you have a smoother transition from blade flat to edge ("appleseed"). The latter requires more work, but results in a better-cutting edge.

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Hello Bjorn,

So are you saying that it's possible to sharpen a typical Del Tin blunt edge(say for example, the 2140) into one with an "appleseed" like edge? I was talking to a person that I consider fairly knowledgable today about such things, and his opinion was that if a sword was meant to be a blunt, (with a 1.5-2mm edge) then it would be very difficult to change it.

My Del Tin swords with the old Krupp steel seem to have .5mm edges, maybe less (I only have a clear plexy glass metric ruler to measure) so it would seem that they could be sharpened to have a decent edge.

In an earlier post, you said that the standard Del Tin edge is .7 mm. That would seem to be similiar to my swords, and if sharpened correctly, would make for a decent cutter?

Thank you.

Mike West

Hey, that's great news. Thanks for clearing that bit of fog. This is a neat site.