For my late Norman kit, I have all the necessary pieces of armor, minus the hand wear. I've read most often that Norman knights used maille mittens, but in a lot of non historical interpretations of them, I see leather gauntlets. Buying a pair of brown welder's gauntlets would be a lot cheaper than buying maille mittens, but I've never seen any pictoral evidence supporting leather gauntlets on a 12th century Norman knight. So would that be historically accurate or nay?
You see leather because maille mittens don't show up until the second half of the 12th C. So if you are doing Conquest, early Crusades, or early Anglo-Norman then maille mittens would be out of place. Of course for safety reasons you have to have something, but unless you are doing late 12th, leather is the way to go.
What kind of leather gauntlets would be my followup to that question, are we looking at anything in particular?
I personally have rather small hands, as such, welding gauntlets are simply WAY too large for my hands (they're 10s or even larger, I have 7.5)
I personally have rather small hands, as such, welding gauntlets are simply WAY too large for my hands (they're 10s or even larger, I have 7.5)
Well they certainly aren't tight on my hands, but they fit over the maille sleeves perfectly, and I've used them so much that I have absolutely no problem moving my fingers appropriately in them. These are the gloves I've been using.
http://www.harborfreight.com/welding-gloves-39664.html
http://www.harborfreight.com/welding-gloves-39664.html
We are talking about leather gloves here right.
RPM
RPM
Corey Skriletz wrote: |
For my late Norman kit, I have all the necessary pieces of armor, minus the hand wear. I've read most often that Norman knights used maille mittens, but in a lot of non historical interpretations of them, I see leather gauntlets. Buying a pair of brown welder's gauntlets would be a lot cheaper than buying maille mittens, but I've never seen any pictoral evidence supporting leather gauntlets on a 12th century Norman knight. So would that be historically accurate or nay? |
As a rule, if you see reenactors wearing hard leather gauntlets its a safety requirement for mock fights with blunt steel weapons. Many historical warriors weren't too concerned with hand protection, or fought in a way which reduced the risk, but today getting a broken hand is a bad idea. There may be a few exceptions, but most of the time its a modern safety measure.
Randall: I don't know what RPM means, but yes, I'm talking about leather welding gloves like the pair I posted a link to.
Sean: I'm not referring to the hard leather hand protection one would see on those who do full-combat reenactment. I'm just referring to leather gloves that would aid in gripping the weapon.
Sean: I'm not referring to the hard leather hand protection one would see on those who do full-combat reenactment. I'm just referring to leather gloves that would aid in gripping the weapon.
If you want a historical glove, you should try for something akin to the riding gloves worn in the I.33 manuscript.
On top of my head I do not remember if there are sources on them in the 12th century, but there are plenty of depictions in the 13th.
Welders gloves are to bulky and rough; riding gloves where luxury items.
On top of my head I do not remember if there are sources on them in the 12th century, but there are plenty of depictions in the 13th.
Welders gloves are to bulky and rough; riding gloves where luxury items.
Corey,
RPM, Randall Porter Moffett- it is my name.
RPM, Randall Porter Moffett- it is my name.
Elling: So more of a smooth, tighter glove like this?
http://www.museumreplicas.com/p-49-leather-gauntlets.aspx
Randall: Oh I see.
http://www.museumreplicas.com/p-49-leather-gauntlets.aspx
Randall: Oh I see.
you might want to consider also something like these
http://www.medieval-market.com/details.php?id_towar=289&s=1
basically a pair of leather gloves covered with gambeson/aketon fabric
possibly a base for adding maille covering
http://www.medieval-market.com/details.php?id_towar=289&s=1
basically a pair of leather gloves covered with gambeson/aketon fabric
possibly a base for adding maille covering
If it's not for safety purposes, why not go for what we definately know is authentic for the period and simply keep the hands bare?
Gives a better 'feel' for the weapon too imho.
Hard to say though without knowing the purpose for you getting the kit together. - If for an accurate representation, no gloves is good - for steel re-enactment combat, you'll need thick leather hand protection as a concession to historical accuracy for safety reasons. I personally can't think of any reasons you would want to look at modern gloves as part of historical kit if not for safety reasons.
Gives a better 'feel' for the weapon too imho.
Hard to say though without knowing the purpose for you getting the kit together. - If for an accurate representation, no gloves is good - for steel re-enactment combat, you'll need thick leather hand protection as a concession to historical accuracy for safety reasons. I personally can't think of any reasons you would want to look at modern gloves as part of historical kit if not for safety reasons.
Corey: Yes, closer. Yet those gloves still look rather modern. The originals as seen in I.33:
[ Linked Image ]
Note that they are depicted white (lambskin). Most commonly, they are seen on civilian noblemen, but since these are the same people as armed noblemen, wearing them with your military gear i not far fetched.
Attachment: 41.38 KB
A gentleman from "life of Edward the Confessor" (1250)
Attachment: 146.67 KB
Me wearing my dandy-gloves with my armour.
[ Linked Image ]
Note that they are depicted white (lambskin). Most commonly, they are seen on civilian noblemen, but since these are the same people as armed noblemen, wearing them with your military gear i not far fetched.
Attachment: 41.38 KB
A gentleman from "life of Edward the Confessor" (1250)
Attachment: 146.67 KB
Me wearing my dandy-gloves with my armour.
I like leather driver gloves (not driving gloves by the way, driver gloves come from the gloves used for cattle and farm work from what I gather).
They tend to be made of good solid leather. Make sure you find the kind without elastic, and if you do make sure you can remove the elastic with ease before buying them. The easy ones to use do not have elastic but they have either a buckle or the like to close the end. You can simply cut this off and you are good.
I still sometimes use welding gaunts if I know they will take some abuse alone as they have a bit more padding on the outside. You can remove this quite easy as well f you need a thinner gauntlet.
RPM
They tend to be made of good solid leather. Make sure you find the kind without elastic, and if you do make sure you can remove the elastic with ease before buying them. The easy ones to use do not have elastic but they have either a buckle or the like to close the end. You can simply cut this off and you are good.
I still sometimes use welding gaunts if I know they will take some abuse alone as they have a bit more padding on the outside. You can remove this quite easy as well f you need a thinner gauntlet.
RPM
Corey Skriletz wrote: |
Randall: I don't know what RPM means, but yes, I'm talking about leather welding gloves like the pair I posted a link to.
Sean: I'm not referring to the hard leather hand protection one would see on those who do full-combat reenactment. I'm just referring to leather gloves that would aid in gripping the weapon. |
I see. I was confused because you were talking about "armour" and "gauntlets" and soft, unpadded leather gloves aren't very good at either.
These in I33 look a lot like the civli & Indian war american cavalry gloves. Maybe civil war re-enactors use something similar that's being sold somewhere on the web?
Here are some...
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006Z8D5AI/ref=asc_d...nkCode=asn
https://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-745-civil-war-union-enlisted-mens-white-leather-gauntlets.aspx
https://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-2035-civil-war-confederate-enlisted-mens-cream-leather-gauntlets.aspx
And a pattern if you want to make your own...
http://www.amazon.com/Pattern-Studio-Gala-Gau...amp;sr=8-1
Better pattern selection.Just type "gauntlets" in the search box...
http://www.patternsoftime.com/search.asp
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B006Z8D5AI/ref=asc_d...nkCode=asn
https://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-745-civil-war-union-enlisted-mens-white-leather-gauntlets.aspx
https://www.atlantacutlery.com/p-2035-civil-war-confederate-enlisted-mens-cream-leather-gauntlets.aspx
And a pattern if you want to make your own...
http://www.amazon.com/Pattern-Studio-Gala-Gau...amp;sr=8-1
Better pattern selection.Just type "gauntlets" in the search box...
http://www.patternsoftime.com/search.asp
Thanks to all of you for your recommendations and help. I have considered going bare-handed, but the maille hauberk I've been using has (for lack of a better word that I can think of) wizard sleeves, which hang down. To remedy this, I bound the sleeves at my wrist with a leather strap. I want a gauntlet to wear over it to hide the bunched-up sleeve, which in my opinion looks very bad. I'm trying to keep the kit aesthetically pleasing, while retaining some measure of historical accuracy.
The driver gloves look great for work around the house, but I can't find any with a cuff big-enough form y purposes.
The three-fingered gloves look very cool. I think they have something like that in the Maciejowski Bible. It's very cool that they're made of Linen, but again I fear the cuff just isn't long enough.
I think the best way to go would be the white lamb-skins that Elling pointed out. I had thought about Civil War gauntlets, but I feel like the designs on the back of the hand look too modern. Does it look to anyone else that the designs could be unstitched?
Just to be sure, the earliest depiction of fingered maille gauntlets wasn't until fifty years later in the Maciejowski Bible, right?
Thanks again, to everyone for your help.
The driver gloves look great for work around the house, but I can't find any with a cuff big-enough form y purposes.
The three-fingered gloves look very cool. I think they have something like that in the Maciejowski Bible. It's very cool that they're made of Linen, but again I fear the cuff just isn't long enough.
I think the best way to go would be the white lamb-skins that Elling pointed out. I had thought about Civil War gauntlets, but I feel like the designs on the back of the hand look too modern. Does it look to anyone else that the designs could be unstitched?
Just to be sure, the earliest depiction of fingered maille gauntlets wasn't until fifty years later in the Maciejowski Bible, right?
Thanks again, to everyone for your help.
By the way, Elling, that's a great kit!
Corey Skriletz wrote: |
I have considered going bare-handed, but the maille hauberk I've been using has (for lack of a better word that I can think of) wizard sleeves, which hang down. To remedy this, I bound the sleeves at my wrist with a leather strap. I want a gauntlet to wear over it to hide the bunched-up sleeve, which in my opinion looks very bad. |
Why don't you just tailor your maille sleeves then? It's not hard to do, even on riveted maille. Getting rid of wizard sleeves a.k.a. batwings makes a hauberk look ten times as good IMHO.
Page 1 of 2
You cannot post new topics in this forumYou cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
All contents © Copyright 2003-2006 myArmoury.com All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Full-featured Version of the forum
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Full-featured Version of the forum