myArmoury.com - Circa 1520 Flemish Sabre in the Tower Armoury

Posts: 35 Location: Texas

Sun 02 May, 2004 10:19 am

Circa 1520 Flemish Sabre in the Tower Armoury

I recently had the pleasure to visit the Tower of London. While there I ran across a really large sabre, from the size certainly intended for two handed use. It was next to some of Henry VIII's armor and was dated circa 1520 and listed as possibly Flemish. It surprised me, as it wasnt the type of weapon I would expect to find in a display of Henry VIII armor and weapons.

I have always been very interested in sabres from this time period, expecially the Kriegsmessers, Swiss Sabres and the like and have noted many posts on this site about such weapons. I have not seen any mention of this (possible) Flemish version here so have attached some pictures I took of it. (the pic's do not do the sabre's size justice, it seemed much bigger in person).

Attachment: 110.18 KB
[ Download ]

Attachment: 116.9 KB
[ Download ]

Attachment: 117.98 KB
[ Download ]

Last edited by Brent Rattan on Sun 02 May, 2004 11:16 am; edited 1 time in total

Profile PM Website

Dan Tucker

Quote

Posts: 30 Location: Cotonou, Benin

Sun 02 May, 2004 10:28 am

interesting piece. I too am a big fan of Swiss sabers, kriegsmessers and the like.

Profile PM

Brian M

Quote

Posts: 500 Location: Austin, TX

Mon 03 May, 2004 11:39 pm

Appreciate the pix. It looks like it was a real "battle" piece, as opposed to a show piece. It looks like it has been extensively honed around the CoP -- although that is only my opinion. I wonder if Peter J has seen this one.

Brian M

Profile PM

Peter Johnsson

Quote

Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 04 May, 2004 12:50 am

Brian M wrote:

Appreciate the pix. It looks like it was a real "battle" piece, as opposed to a show piece. It looks like it has been extensively honed around the CoP -- although that is only my opinion. I wonder if Peter J has seen this one.

Brian M

Nice blade!
Never seen this one before.
Attractive curvature.
Looks like an etching of a saint or Holy Mary at the base of the blade. As something at the rivets seems to be missing or remade (as well as a missing pommelcap?) the look of this one might be deceiving. I think it could well have been a stunning and elegant sword when new, not just a "beater".
I also wonder if the rivet through the cross might at one time have held a wing or leaf as knuckle protection?
Together with the type of assembly of the grip, it might be classified as a messer type of sword?

Profile PM Website

Brent Rattan

Quote

Posts: 35 Location: Texas

Tue 04 May, 2004 6:23 am

It is a very cool piece.

In person it certainly appeared be a true battle sword, but I agree that it surely was quite a looker when new. I do not rememeber anything seeming to be missing, except for a few rivets and it did not seem to have ever had a pommel cap.

I do remeber that I had the feeling that it had been honed quite a bit, and thought that some of the pitting and discoloration at the fore of the blade may have been from blood and use. There are a couple of nicks in the blade.

The placard says that those are St Catherine and St Barbara and these etchings were very striking in person.

Profile PM Website

Peter Johnsson

Quote

Posts: 1,757 Location: Storvreta, Sweden

Tue 04 May, 2004 8:37 am

Brent Rattan wrote:

It is a very cool piece.

In person it certainly appeared be a true battle sword, but I agree that it surely was quite a looker when new. I do not rememeber anything seeming to be missing, except for a few rivets and it did not seem to have ever had a pommel cap.

I do remeber that I had the feeling that it had been honed quite a bit, and thought that some of the pitting and discoloration at the fore of the blade may have been from blood and use. There are a couple of nicks in the blade.

The placard says that those are St Catherine and St Barbara and these etchings were very striking in person.

A sword for serious use, no doubt about it!
It is not unusual that weapons made for serious use also reflect discriminate customer tastes and the pride of the craftsman in the decoration and/or design.
We sometimes hear the idea that sword meant for use were crude affairs. This is to me a strange notion. A bit irregular maybe, and often unassuming, but very seldom just crude beaters with no inherent elegance.

Interesting that it never had a pommel cap.
Thanks for first hand impressions!
I need to have a closer look at this one next time in London :D

Profile PM Website

Bill Duncan

Quote

Posts: 74 Location: Macon Georgia

Wed 05 May, 2004 12:29 am

Sorry I am posting so late on the but came across this post while doing research and had to comment.
I saw this blade a couple of months ago and have to say what an impressive piece, very much a true battle sword.
Dunc

Attachment: 72.1 KB

Profile PM E-mail

Scott Byler

Quote

Posts: 209 Location: New Mexico

Wed 05 May, 2004 5:11 am

I think it has a nice and striking character... Wish I had one to play with. It has many similarities to a sword I commissioned once that didn't work out... I still find I wish I had that piece. It would have been quite similar in profile especially to this one, though my design did have a pommel/pommel cap. Sigh... guess I need to get really good really fast and make one myself. lol

Profile PM