Hello. Got a tip that this is the forum to research armour, so here goes my query;
I am looking for pics of original kettlehat fitting the mid to late 15th century. I will have a armourer do a helmet for me and i want to go with the kettlehat, but want to try and find as many originals as possible before i settle for one. So if anyone has documentation of these type on helmets please post pix, or book references perhapse also would be helpful.

Thank you in advance.

Hello and welcome to myArmoury.com. :) Kettle helms have been discussed here before, so using the search function should yield at least a little info and some pics.

Most quality arms and armour books discuss and show kettle helms. Unfortunately, many of these books are out of print or are expensive. I'd recommend these, though, if you can get a hold of them:

2,500 years of European helmets, 800 B.C.-1700 A.D by Howard M Curtis. My favorite book on helmets. Unfortunately, while it shows many many examples of helmets, including a number of kettle helms, it's hard to find and expensive. Expect to pay $200 or more for a copy of that book.

Arms & Armor of the Medieval Knight. Another good one. Also out of print, it can be had for less than $100 (often much less than $100) and is a great book on European Armour.

European armour, circa 1066 to circa 1700 by Claude Blair. Another classic, though also out of print. This one can be bought for circa $50.

There are others, too, but these are my top picks. For more book reviews and recommendations, check out our Bookstore.

Tnx for the reply. I have indeed looked though some armourbooks, a couple of the ones mensioned above also, but ive found nothing really. It seems that this is a widely used helmet in the late middleages but very few seem to have remained, compared to the more graceful sallet.

That would be great. What im looking for are helmets like the ones attached, and also like the ones that are not so deep and that have the onion shape, like in the dolnstein picture -
[ Linked Image ]

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Hi,

Try these links:

http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm47...at47_2.txt

http://www.hermann-historica.de/auktion/hhm47...at47_2.txt

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Nephtys...t05086.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Nephtys...t05087.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Nephtys...vor_01.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Nephtys...vor_02.jpg

M.,

What MS is that drawing from? Do you know the possible date, origin or any other info? Looks pretty interesting.

Have you looked at best armour.com? Some really good recreations if you are just trying to get ideas.

RPM

In my copy of "In the Service of the Duke" there are several decent illustrations of kettle hats. I don't have a scanner, but if I can get my daughter to let me use hers I will try and post here.

check out the Guild of st george's dragon pdf files. i believe there is a helmet page with several different drawings of them

Daniel,

I just did a search on his name but could not find his journal published anywhere. Do you know if it has been? IN English would be prefered as german is not a language I have much strength in. The artword is very good. It looks very similar to some earlier picture associated with the Hussites...

I will try getting ahold of the osprey books. It looks very descriptive and the fact that unlike many artists he was a soldier who was there would be really invaluble to get a clear insight on what his experience was like, armour and weapon use, clothing etc. I have to say the diary interests me perhaps more now that I have heard this. I think I may have heard of him in the past but never checked it out. Thanks for the info.

RPM

Some kettlehats/kettlesallets. I would also like to see some more examples of this helmet type. Too bad not more of them are preserved. But i guess if you need to reforge a helmet for changed battlefield-conditions you will take the kettlehat before you chop the sallet...

Innsbruck 1460,
[ Linked Image ]

Anyone know where/when this one below is from? Hmm is finish hammer-marks, graverust or both perhapse?

http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/5549/15thc...letpu7.jpg

Randall,
In order to not disrupt the current thread with and extensive off-topic subject I've started a new thread about the Dolnstein diary here: http://www.myArmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?p=112619

Daniel

Here's that page from Dragon:

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As I´m looking for a Kettlehat fitting to my end of 14.Cent. Harness, I would like to know, if someone has Pictures, Scans or something about unusal Kettlehats for a knight from 1370-1400 southern Germany/Bohenmia/northern Italy...preserved helmets are very rare, one I know is more nothern Germany and I couldn´t reach one of the recommended books (sold out...).
thanks a lot

Peter

Here are a few drawings of Italian Kettlhats, the first with the regular brim is a little earlier, the second with nasal is from a painting of Altichiero, which was dated around 1370.

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Here are two from the Pistoia alter piece that might loosely be called that, but one looks more like a morion to me!

Around 1376 or possibly a few years earlier.

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Here is a particular favourite of mine, from the Royal Armouries in Leeds. It is Italian and dated, I think, to ca.1470. It is shown here fitted with a rather fetching bevor/barbote. :)

Hi Willhelm ! :) Long time no hear !!

That second helmet that you show does not seem right to me. It just looks wrong, to my eyes anyway. The enormous depth of it, the very straight sides, and the eye slit too look quite wrong and too small to me, almost as if they were cut in as an after thought, which some were to make them saleable in the 19th century! Do you possibly have any other pictures of it ??
Hope that all is going well for you?

Regards,

Russ

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Hey Russ, nice to see you are up and around! Will have to visit your workshop and steal all your books at one time or another..;D

This helmet is the resault of trying to recreate a mid/late 15th cen germanic kettle-hat, and its based on several of the (few) originals of this type of helmet remaining as well as period artwork. Forged and hand-finished by Swedens prominent armourer Albert Collins, (hand-tanned leather straps by my crafty and sweet girlfriend..)

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...203236.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...203458.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...203354.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...203528.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...203927.jpg
http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p19/De-Pro...204127.jpg

The peice of period artwork that was the main source of inspiration, Hans Hirtze, Swiss ca 1460;
http://www.uni-leipzig.de/ru/bilder/passion2/hirtz02.jpg

My new helmet. Made by Albert Collins. An attempt at making a very Swedish helmet, based on Swedish church-art, images from Paul Dolnsteins diary, originals at the Museum of National Antiquities and other originals from Germany dating ca 1460.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3075/2736787836_1c24125fca_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3065/2736799898_a926ef0b40_b.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3135/2735981005_7fb4271bdc_b.jpg