I was looking at this image from Warlords and I was wondering about the outer armor on the figure on the bottom right. It looks like some kind of reinforced surcoat. And it looks like it just has round metal plates attached to it. So the question is what is that based on I have not seen one in a picture from the time periods it shows it used in the book. So does any one know of any images of armor like it either in pantings, fragments from finds or even recreations?

By the way the caption says. "Edward Bruce attacked by Anglo-Irish warrios a Moiry Pass in Armagh Ulser 1315."

Oh also later in the same books it shows the same kind of armor on an english pikeman in 1513.

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I could be wrong but I think that surcoat is just artistic license if you will. Not sure that it ever really existed. Of course now that I say that someone will come int with several pictures of such a thing. but I like learning about new armour so it works

Ya could be just that. That is what I am trying to figure out. But I did find an image that shows armor like it. But I am not sure what the second image is based on. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ringmail It says it came from this book. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Historians%2..._the_World

Here is one from 1299 that looks something roughly like it. The discs on seem to be more of decoration than armor. And it could be there are plates under it but it is not clear like on some of the effigies that have coats of plates.

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I'm going with artistic license.
Angus McBride was a cool artist (one of the people who inspired me to pursue history), but methinks it's only for dramatic effet. Kind of like RPG 'studded' leather :lol:

Possible but some countries did have studded armor just not western ones.

Not up on my D&D but there were the coats of a thousand nails http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Nephtys..._nails.jpg And some had plates behind and some did not. And of course chines armor of the same type etc Now were all the ones without backing plates just for ceremonial use or light armor from what I can tell that is still being debated.

And yes I already new about Faux brigandine and normal brigandines and the history of this type of armor.

Any way it is looking like he just pulled it out of thin air as I tend to think the effigy what ever time it is from is just decoration.

Pat what you've reference is Indo-Persina/Mohgul, 18th century. Theres a decent discussion of it here http://forums.armourarchive.org/phpBB2/viewto...mor+armour

Europe had no such similar garment.

I know and I never said Europe did:) It was a follow up to where I said "Possible but some countries did have studded armor just not western ones." .

Whoa, easy there sparky, just pointing out a thread that might be of interest to you since you mentioned the type of armour. No need to be bent, no offense was intended.

Sorry did not mean it to come across like it was. I was just in a hurry when I replied. That's a problem with forums a lot of times you cant tell how something was said. :)

There is however, pictures in a manuscript (to wich I lost the adress and forgotten the nam, duh!) where several knights have coat of plates with big, round spots on them. Much like the picrute above. Most likely they are washers to prevent the rivets fron going through the fabric/leather covering. The main fault with the picture above is that the soldier seem to have a loose garment whereas it should be a much tighter fit. and the "rings" och whatever to call them should be sitting in rows along the edges of the plates underneath. Undoftunately Mr. McBride was not always the best at listening to the authors descriptions... This is not the only picture in which he has done something similar. If you take a look in "Medieval Scandinavian Armies" you will find a strange detail like this in virtually every colourplate in the books...

So it's most likely just a VERY large amount of artistic freedom in displaying a coat of plates...

Yes it seems like he did use a lot of artistic license.

I think I found the illustration he based that on or one very much like it. http://books.google.com/books?id=_8rM-0MQv5MC...mp;f=false

Here is a picture of the carving. http://www.bildindex.de/bilder/mi00089a09a.jpg