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Adam M.M.





Joined: 02 Aug 2014

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PostPosted: Wed 05 Nov, 2014 6:15 am    Post subject: Use of arming swords without bucklers         Reply with quote

I see a lot of soldiers with arming swords and no bucklers in artwork, but treatises seem to focus on longsword and sword and buckler, with only some 16th century treatises showing sidesword in one hand. So my question is was it common for soldiers to use arming swords without bucklers? More or less common than with a buckler? And if it was used, how come there doesn't seem to be any treatises dedicated to it?
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Stephen Curtin




Location: Cork, Ireland
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PostPosted: Wed 05 Nov, 2014 8:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Adam. AFAIK in some of the 15th century manuscripts that teach sword and buckler. Some times a sword is used, and other times a messer is used. So it could be that these two weapons were seen as fairly interchangeable. If this was the casse the there wouldn't be any need to dedicate a section of a treatise to arming sword, were messer was already covered.
Éirinn go Brách
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Adam M.M.





Joined: 02 Aug 2014

Posts: 54

PostPosted: Wed 05 Nov, 2014 8:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Stephen Curtin wrote:
Hi Adam. AFAIK in some of the 15th century manuscripts that teach sword and buckler. Some times a sword is used, and other times a messer is used. So it could be that these two weapons were seen as fairly interchangeable. If this was the casse the there wouldn't be any need to dedicate a section of a treatise to arming sword, were messer was already covered.


Good point, I'd always thought of the messer as a separate weapon, but it makes sense that it would be used much the same way as an arming sword.
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Raman A




Location: United States
Joined: 25 Aug 2011

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PostPosted: Wed 05 Nov, 2014 9:51 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Fiore has a section of his treatise dedicated to the sword in one hand.
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Stephen Curtin




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PostPosted: Thu 06 Nov, 2014 2:23 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well Fiore doesn't really teach single handed/arming sword. He teaches the use of longsword in one hand. Though I'm sure Fiore's techniques would need little, if any, modificationfor use with an arming sword.
Éirinn go Brách
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Lafayette C Curtis




Location: Indonesia
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PostPosted: Sun 16 Nov, 2014 10:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

And of course people could perfectly well go hacking away with their swords without any prior systematic training. The fact that medieval martial arts existed doesn't mean that everybody knew them (although of course they were probably far more widespread than they are today).
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