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Robert Roeder




Location: Western NY
Joined: 09 Mar 2009

Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon 30 Sep, 2013 11:43 am    Post subject: help with sword blade ID         Reply with quote

Hello,

A friend of mine showed an old sword blade he was given that he thought I could help him identify. I do not have images but can describe some of its features along with some markings.

To me it appears to be a "rapier" type blade - long and narrow (easily about 40+ inches from tip to end of remaining tang). The widest section of the blade nearest the hilt is no more than 3/4 inch. There is a section of about 4-5 inches that is rectangular in cross-section leading to the fullered section then to the cruciform blade. The tip was definitely sharpened to a point, not blunted like a fencing blade.

The only markings that could be identified are stamped (in capital letters) into the fuller on each side of the blade - one side is stamped "MARIA" the other "IESVS". Of course I assume they mean Mary and Jesus. There is also a small (maker's ?) stamp which to me looks like a stylized "W" or "H" with a Maltese cross beneath.

Thank you in advance for any assistance.

Rob

Bob Roeder
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Sean Flynt
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Location: Birmingham, Alabama
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PostPosted: Mon 30 Sep, 2013 12:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Impossible for anybody to say without a photo, but my first thought is that it's from a modern fraternal sword (e.g., Knights of Columbus). Some of those blades are acutely pointed, and they're pretty common.
-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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Robert Roeder




Location: Western NY
Joined: 09 Mar 2009

Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon 30 Sep, 2013 12:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sean Flynt wrote:
Impossible for anybody to say without a photo, but my first thought is that it's from a modern fraternal sword (e.g., Knights of Columbus). Some of those blades are acutely pointed, and they're pretty common.


Thank you Sean.

Yes, that was the first thing I thought of when I saw it. The only problem is it was dug up on private land in the area of a southern arsenal that was destroyed during the Civil War. I definitely thought of some fraternal order, but then one begins to question the deposition - Why was it buried? - Which can easily lead to much speculation.

The blade is somewhat corroded - darkened (possibly exposed to fire) w/ some oxidation, but still in pretty decent shape; you could still make out the details of the stamped lettering. Nothing of the guard, handle, or pommel remains. I thought the stamped lettering and especially the odd (Latin?) spelling of "IESVS might give a clue.

Bob Roeder
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Ruel A. Macaraeg





Joined: 25 Aug 2003

Posts: 306

PostPosted: Tue 01 Oct, 2013 7:15 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Robert Roeder wrote:
The only problem is it was dug up on private land in the area of a southern arsenal that was destroyed during the Civil War. I definitely thought of some fraternal order, but then one begins to question the deposition - Why was it buried? - Which can easily lead to much speculation
Robert,
The White Settlement Historical Museum has a similar sword which was also recovered from underground, though no other details are known: http://www.forensicfashion.com/1888AmericanFreemasonSword.html

http://ForensicFashion.com/CostumeStudies.html


Last edited by Ruel A. Macaraeg on Tue 01 Oct, 2013 8:50 am; edited 1 time in total
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Daniel Wallace




Location: Pennsylvania USA
Joined: 07 Aug 2011

Posts: 580

PostPosted: Tue 01 Oct, 2013 8:19 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

[quote="Robert Roeder"]
Sean Flynt wrote:


The blade is somewhat corroded - darkened (possibly exposed to fire)


if this is would be true - it strengthens a fraternity blade like knights of Columbus. i truly don't know what they do with their swords they are most probably buried with them when the owner passes. all object considered blessed, must be burned. i worked for my church for years and did feel a little odd when i was asked to burn and bury statuary that was damaged beyond repair.

with a few pictures I'm sure someone here will id it within a day.
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