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Sven P




Location: Newyork
Joined: 15 Jun 2013

Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Late 14th century armor         Reply with quote

Hello! I am currently putting together my suit of late 14th century armor. It currently consists of a pair of gauntlets that are a variant of the wisby gauntlets, a pair of greaves, articulated spaulders, and I am working on full plate legs and arms with rondels. The breastplate will either either be one solid piece or perhaps three, in a churburg sort of way. However, I am adding this greathelm. I am afraid my harness is too late for the greathelm? Do you guys think I can get away with it?


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greathelm cerca 1350.jpg

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Mart Shearer




Location: Jackson, MS, USA
Joined: 18 Aug 2012

Posts: 1,287

PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun, 2013 6:21 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've seen the Kornburg helm dated between 1350-1370. How late is "late 14th century"? I would presume after 1375, so the helm is a bit dated for the last quarter 1376-1400.
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Sven P




Location: Newyork
Joined: 15 Jun 2013

Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun, 2013 6:30 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well, I would say around maybe 1380, what do you think? You read the description.
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Mart Shearer




Location: Jackson, MS, USA
Joined: 18 Aug 2012

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PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun, 2013 6:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Such a helm might have still been used in tournament or the occaisonal battlefield joust, but it would be far outnumbered by bascinets. I think there are a couple of German manuscript images dated to 1380 showing some sort of helm in use, but there are hundreds showing bascinets.
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/search/?year=...anuscript=

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Sven P




Location: Newyork
Joined: 15 Jun 2013

Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat 15 Jun, 2013 7:08 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well, I am a big greathelm fan, and I don't quite have the skill to make a bascinet. So long as there is a reference towards it's use on the battle field that is really all I needed. Thanks!
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Ian S LaSpina




Location: Virginia, US
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PostPosted: Sun 16 Jun, 2013 8:52 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Wisby style gauntlets and a great helm would place your harness a little earlier. Is there a reason you'd be resistant to making a nice mid-14th century kit instead that would suit your taste in helmets and gauntlets more appropriately?
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Sven P




Location: Newyork
Joined: 15 Jun 2013

Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sun 16 Jun, 2013 9:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

No, I just thought that using a full breastplate would place it a bit later, but I guess it could still be more mid 14th century. The arms consist of a vambrace, an elbow cop, and I haven't yet decided whether or not to add a rerebrace, as the pauldrons will have a curved extension that I am not sure what it is called, combine that with no fauld, a hauberk, and full p[ate legs with maille sabatons, what would you date that as?
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Ian S LaSpina




Location: Virginia, US
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PostPosted: Sun 16 Jun, 2013 1:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Rounded body defenses appear on effigies commonly in the 1350's. It might be assumed they're solid breastplates, but in the 14th century almost all harnesses are covered in some sort of textile or heraldic surcoat that it's hard to tell exactly what it is underneath. Full sabs appear on effigies with frequency in the 1340's, and cuisses in the 1340's/50's.

Here's an excellent resource for your period of interest that breaks down the appearance of the frequency of various types of armor by decade based on their appearance on effigies.

http://talbotsfineaccessories.com/armour/effi...figies.htm

Note that effigy dating is a little tricky, and is not always 100% accurate to the time of the effigy's creation, but it's a very good general guideline. I would recommend using that site by it's optional regional-specific information to give you a more accurate impression since these things varied by geographical location.

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