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Mackenzie Cosens




Location: Vancouver Canada
Joined: 08 Aug 2007

Posts: 238

PostPosted: Wed 28 Sep, 2011 3:36 pm    Post subject: Does anyone know this manuscript & LOOK at the cool chop         Reply with quote

this set of manuscripts contain some of the coolest swords and choppy things since the Mispronounceski bible (Maciejowski Bible Just humour, no slur intended)
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/search/?year=...ew=gallery

Does anyone know the manuscript? It appears to me to be something to do with the first crusade and the Capture of Jerusalem?

Mackenzie
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Yuri Serebemnick





Joined: 03 Sep 2008

Posts: 35

PostPosted: Thu 29 Sep, 2011 6:30 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I was going to ask you guys about the curved blades.
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Ralph Grinly





Joined: 19 Jan 2011

Posts: 320

PostPosted: Thu 29 Sep, 2011 2:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

When I hover my mouse over the pictures I see - KA20 Spieghel Historiael f 213v - could this be the manuscript/folio name/number. Hope this helps track it down.

One thing I noticed..on the seventh pic from top..two of the knights seem to be using their swords in a dagger-like, stabbing fashion. They are def using swords, not daggers ( daggers can be seen in use in the sixth pic). I realise we can't take manuscript illustrations as gospel regarding weapons-use, but has anyone seen swords used in similar ways in other illustrations ?

I think the characters using curved swords are supposed to be representing Turks or Saracens. Curved swords were often the distinguishing mark of Saracens in manuscripts.
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Daniel Wallace




Location: Pennsylvania USA
Joined: 07 Aug 2011

Posts: 580

PostPosted: Fri 30 Sep, 2011 7:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

in doing a quick search Spieghel historiael translates to the mirror of history by an author (Jacob van Maerlant) that is writing a collection of history this link i found (quite quickly) http://collecties.meermanno.nl/handschriften/showmanu?id=1205 give a brief description of some of the panels shown.

i find the blade in the 4th panel interesting. it looks like some kind of falchion blade with a really pronounced outward curve and returns with a slight sweep back. the ridge also seems to illustrate that it's bevels are definitely on the inside of that curve. man that's chopper there.
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Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 486

PostPosted: Fri 30 Sep, 2011 9:13 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Past halfway down there is an image of what looks clearly like a man wearing scale armor.

http://manuscriptminiatures.com/spieghel-historiael-ka-20/213/

E Pluribus Unum
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Michael Zander





Joined: 25 Nov 2009

Posts: 6

PostPosted: Fri 30 Sep, 2011 3:54 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ralph Grinly wrote:
When I hover my mouse over the pictures I see - KA20 Spieghel Historiael f 213v - could this be the manuscript/folio name/number. Hope this helps track it down.

If you click any of the images, you get all the info: manuscript designation and title, holding institution (and link), location, folio, etc. Everything you need should be there.
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Mackenzie Cosens




Location: Vancouver Canada
Joined: 08 Aug 2007

Posts: 238

PostPosted: Fri 30 Sep, 2011 11:51 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Michael Zander wrote:
Ralph Grinly wrote:
When I hover my mouse over the pictures I see - KA20 Spieghel Historiael f 213v - could this be the manuscript/folio name/number. Hope this helps track it down.

If you click any of the images, you get all the info: manuscript designation and title, holding institution (and link), location, folio, etc. Everything you need should be there.


Thanks
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Greg Mele
Industry Professional



Location: Chicago, IL USA
Joined: 20 Mar 2006

Posts: 356

PostPosted: Mon 03 Oct, 2011 11:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ralph Grinly wrote:

One thing I noticed..on the seventh pic from top..two of the knights seem to be using their swords in a dagger-like, stabbing fashion. They are def using swords, not daggers ( daggers can be seen in use in the sixth pic). I realise we can't take manuscript illustrations as gospel regarding weapons-use, but has anyone seen swords used in similar ways in other illustrations ?


It is surprisingly common, especially in ms dated about 1250 - 1400, usually with mounted figures. There are examples in the Meliadus Ms, I believe in the Mac Bible and elsewhere.

Greg

Greg Mele
Chicago Swordplay Guild
www.chicagoswordplayguild.com

www.freelanceacademypress.com
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