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Victor R.




Location: Spring, Texas
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
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Posts: 234

PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 1:30 pm    Post subject: Pole Arms - Ritter Steel?         Reply with quote

I've seen several items on polearms in the forum recently and, as I've been maturing in my perspective on the arms & armor likely to be used by a man-at-arms in the late 14th/early 15th, I seem to have finally gotten through my skull that while swords are sexy, the well armed soldier was more likely to enter the fight with a good pole arm and rely only on the sword as a secondary weapon.

I've been trolling around the web looking at various offerings and ran across this:

http://www.knightsedge.com/p-105-german-knights-halberds.aspx

It is under their "Ritter Steel" line and appears to be fairly sturdy, if not a bit overbuilt (I have the Ritter Steel German Warhammer - heavy as all get out, a little crude, but would put a serious hurt on someone if smacked).

Now to the questions:

Historical accuracy - does it pass muster? Is it a good example of a period piece, or would someone with good knowledge be pointing and laughing?

Personal experience - anyone handled? Is it as overbuilt as it looks?

While I haven't done so, yet, I've been planning to shave-down the haft of the warhammer (imagine a 3x2 with the edges eased) and remove all the black paint. Would probably do a similar job on this item, if it otherwise seems a decent piece.

Your thoughts/opinions would be greatly appreciated. If you do not feel comfortable having them in the open forum, a PM would be great.

Thanks.
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Bartek Strojek




Location: Poland
Joined: 05 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 2:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

As far as historical accuracy goes, I would unfortunately side with "pointing and laughing" camp.

Many of those look outlandish, and their descriptions don't look optimistic either.

Some, as one of the war hammers looks definitely passable though, at least IMO.

Those are my 2 c.
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Sean Flynt
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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 2:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

You can do much, much better in every respect, especially at that price.
-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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Victor R.




Location: Spring, Texas
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Reading list: 4 books

Posts: 234

PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 5:02 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Okay - early returns not far off from what I expected.

An added question: what non-custom piece might you recommend?

Time frame: 1370 - 1420
Geography: historic family roots are Lower Saxony area of modern Germany, so that is the area I look to for inspiration for other arms & armor.
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Hadrian Coffin
Industry Professional



Location: Oxford, England
Joined: 03 Apr 2008

Posts: 383

PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 7:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hello,
I would stay away from "knights edge", I don't see a single thing I would consider accurate. That polearm is not remotely accurate... Sorry.
What's your budget? How much work are you willing to put into it? I can't really make any recomendations without knowing.
Cheers

Historia magistra vitae est
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JE Sarge
Industry Professional



PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 7:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

On the lowest end of the price spectrum, I'd consider one of the GDFB pole arm heads. You can haft them yourself and save a ton of money on something that looks decent.





Either of these can be had for $35-$45 at various vendors. I own both, and once they are done up - they are not that bad at all for the money. They are not a fraction as nice as the A&A counterparts, but from a distance, they look fine. They perform well too, that is, for the money... Happy

J.E. Sarge
Crusader Monk Sword Scabbards and Customizations
www.crusadermonk.com

"But lack of documentation, especially for such early times, is not to be considered as evidence of non-existance." - Ewart Oakeshott
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Benjamin H. Abbott




Location: New Mexico
Joined: 28 Feb 2004

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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 7:43 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Medieval German Knights Halberd looks vaguely like the halberds carried by officers and guards in the late sixteenth century and on. It's definitely not appropriate for a medieval German noble. The rectangular haft that they tout is reasonable, however; you see that on many halberds and pollaxes.
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JG Elmslie
Industry Professional



Location: Scotland
Joined: 18 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 7:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Victor R. wrote:
Okay - early returns not far off from what I expected.

An added question: what non-custom piece might you recommend?

Time frame: 1370 - 1420
Geography: historic family roots are Lower Saxony area of modern Germany, so that is the area I look to for inspiration for other arms & armor.



in that price range, you might want to look at Pavel Marek's stuff... something like this:

http://www.armorymarek.com/public/default/use...rs/133.jpg
(admittedly a wee bit later in date than 1420's) is pretty much the same price as what you were looking at and isnt so much a better as in an entirely different league.
and if you want to go to the effort, for the same price as that Knightsedge stuff, you could get two decent quality halberd heads of different styles, and haft 'em up yourself in a similar way to Sean's recent post thread.

http://www.armorymarek.com/halberds--war-hammers--spears

is the webpage for his polearms. Never heard a negative word about his work, either.
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Matthew Stagmer
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Location: Maryland, USA
Joined: 23 Jan 2008

Posts: 473

PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 7:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Wow at 35$ that is crazy. I can't get the steel to make one for that.
Matthew Stagmer
Maker of custom and production weaponry
www.BaltimoreKnife.com
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Scott Hrouda




Location: Minnesota, USA
Joined: 17 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 8:06 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Matthew Stagmer wrote:
Wow at 35$ that is crazy. I can't get the steel to make one for that.

True, but you're used to dealing with a much higher quality steel and end product.

I have commented on other threads that they are nice for the price. I had to spend some time filing rough langet welds, another member has a hammer head out of alingment and rough welds. When I "antiqued" my head, previously unnoticed welds showed up and I had to spend extra time righting the situation.

Cheap steel + cheap manufacturing = cheap prices. I'm not trying to scare anyone away; I love mine as a project piece (lot's of fun learning!), it will make a handsome display and it may kill a few pumpkins next week. I would not suggest medium to hard play with these though.

...and that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana shaped. - Sir Bedevere
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Sean Flynt
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PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 8:29 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I have three decent German polearms that I probably won't keep but they're all later than your interest (all three are meant to be 1450-1500). Sorry! Sad
-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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Victor R.




Location: Spring, Texas
Joined: 28 Jan 2008
Reading list: 4 books

Posts: 234

PostPosted: Thu 26 Aug, 2010 8:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks for all the input, so far.

I had visited the Marek site the other day - have liked his stuff for a very long time, just haven't been a patron, as yet.

As for price range, the price point wasn't the focus. By point of reference, I have succumbed to the siren song of Albion a half dozen times - three direct, three from forumites. Big Grin Then again, I'm not really looking to go absolutely crazy, either. Just would like to find something of good quality and reasonably representative, fairly priced.

After some early, very a-historic purchases when I first started to get interested in this area a few years ago, I began to focus on finding better quality in a more focused timeframe and region. That's a bit easier to do with swords, armor, clothing and certain other items. This particular search has been a bit more difficult.

I appreciate all the feedback and recommendations and look forward to that still forthcoming.

Edit - Sean's post hit while I was composing. While the focus of what I'm building now is late 14th, early 15th, my initial foray into collecting and interest was more late 15th. Presently no pole arms representing that era in my collection, either. Big Grin
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