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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Thu 13 May, 2010 1:50 am    Post subject: Tent design 1100-1300         Reply with quote

Hi, I am looking for evidence of tent designs for the period 1100-1300. I've been up and down the internet but I can't find much useful material. Most of the images I found are from later periods. I did find websites such as Medieval Pavilion Resources but these have largely gone unmaintained and most links don't work anymore.

All I have figured out so far is that the "geteld" tent design shown in some 12th paintings are in fact copies of the 9th century Utrecht Psalter. So, those paintings don't say anything about 12th century tent designs, just about 9th century designs.

Would a round pavilion with spokes (i.e. no perimeter poles) be acceptable?

Thanks in advance!
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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 8:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bump. No ideas about tents in 1100-1300?
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Scott Hrouda




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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 9:07 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here's a few links that you might find useful.
currentmiddleages.org/tents
currentmiddleages.org/tents/tentlinks2

Granted, most of the links are "how to" but there is some good historical documentation references on this page.

I hope this helps with your quest!

...and that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana shaped. - Sir Bedevere
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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 12:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Scott, but unfortunately that's the same website I linked in my original post. Almost all the links about the 10th to 12th century are dead. It's a good resource, but it has gone unmaintained and suffers heavily from link-rot.
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Scott Hrouda




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PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 4:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sander Marechal wrote:
Thanks Scott, but unfortunately that's the same website I linked in my original post.


Duh... *smacks head repeatedly*

Sorry Sander... Blush

...and that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana shaped. - Sir Bedevere
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Craig Peters




PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 5:24 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Sander,

Did you check out the Maciejowski Bible?

http://www.medievaltymes.com/courtyard/images...otm3rd.gif

http://www.medievaltymes.com/courtyard/images...otm3va.gif

http://www.medievaltymes.com/courtyard/images...otm4vb.gif

I'm sure there are many more images besides these, but since the tents for the most part seem to be the same design and construction, there probably isn't much point in linking many more images.
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Craig Peters




PostPosted: Wed 19 May, 2010 5:31 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Not the best quality, but a tent from the 1196 Liber ad Honorem Augusti:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons...zilien.jpg
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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 2:14 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Quote:
Did you check out the Maciejowski Bible?


*slaps forehead*. Nope, thanks. When I have an arms and armour question I always spends a few hours looking at the Maciejowski Bible before posting here, but for tents I totally forgot to do this. Thanks!

So, from those images I get a round pavilion with one center pole and no perimiter poles.
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Julien M




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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 2:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Well here is a perfect opportunity to pratice your french Happy

That guy just finished one here:

http://guerriers-du-moyen-age.aceboard.fr/123...-XIIIe.htm

Cheers,

J
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Scott Hrouda




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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 1:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Trying to redeem myself here...

The National Library of the Netherlands (Koninklijke Bibliotheek) has a great website dedicated to displaying Medieval Illuminated Manuscripts in their collection.

A simple search by "tent" reveals six hits. One of the six falls within your time period.

"Judith before Holofernes' tent" is from the Histoire ancienne jusqu'ą César c. 1250-1275

As an aside, this is a great website for research!

...and that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana shaped. - Sir Bedevere
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Sander Marechal




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PostPosted: Thu 20 May, 2010 1:27 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

That's an excellent resource Scott! You've certainly redeemed yourself Happy
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Harry Marinakis




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PostPosted: Sat 20 Apr, 2013 10:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Bump for an old thread.

I'd like to narrow the original post's time frame to AD 1100-1200.

It's easy to find a lot of stuff for the 13th Century, but dang, 12th Century is tough to research.
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Peter Lyon
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PostPosted: Sat 20 Apr, 2013 1:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If you want to look at Byzantine tents c.1200 there are a couple of resources:
Chronicle of John Scylitzes (11th century) also called the Madrid Scylitzes (held by the Biblioteca Nacional, Madrid)
Chronicle of Tetrus de Eboli, depicting the seige of Naples 1190-1197
Both of these show a "soft" shaped form of the later medieval round pavilion, with pegged base and multiple guys off the valance, but no top guys. The roof shape is a bit distorted by what looks like an applied fabric band with decoration.
Sources:
The Moors, by Michael Brett and Werner Forman, p16
Byzantium, by Paul Hetherington and Werner Forman, p66
http://65.102.22.82/tents/JohnScylitz.htm
Warfare in the Middle Ages, by Richard Humble, p80

There is also a late 12th century casket in Vannes cathedral showing a classic round pavilion, though the lower walls are relativley short. No link I know of, this is from "Furniture 700-1700", pages 96-97.

Also a (possibly 13th century) image of three bell tents, at www.mediumaevum.com/image/camp_and_march/7011642.jpg

If you go into the 13th century there are many more images from manuscripts.
In case nobody has pointed it out, there are precisely zero extant tents or identifiable tent fragments between about 900 and c.1517, with the example of a complete royal tent in a Spanish museum, which is all rather unhelpful to you.

Still hammering away
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Boris Bedrosov
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PostPosted: Sat 20 Apr, 2013 2:38 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Talking about Chronicle of John Scylitzes, you could take a look here:

http://bdh.bne.es/bnesearch/detalle/1754254

Click on "View Work" and then from the list on the left choose images
Vitr_000026-002_0203.jpg
Vitr_000026-002_0315.jpg
Vitr_000026-002_0412.jpg
Vitr_000026-002_0437.jpg
Vitr_000026-002_0443.jpg
and you could see some fine examples of period art. Of course, in the Chronicle itself there are more images, representing tents (or at least, tent-like object), but I think, these images are the best of them.

And these two tents of the middle



were made using the images from the Chronicle of John Scylitzes as a source.

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Mart Shearer




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PostPosted: Sat 20 Apr, 2013 5:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I tagged these two sources at Manuscript Miniatures for convienience as well.
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/search/?year=...ew=gallery

ferrum ferro acuitur et homo exacuit faciem amici sui
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Harry Marinakis




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PostPosted: Mon 22 Apr, 2013 7:14 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Tents shown in the manuscript Liber ad honoreum Augusti
by Pietro da Eboli
ca. A.D. 1197

Images of tents during the the German conquest of Italy by King Barbarossa:

http://warfare.uphero.com/Medieval/Liber_ad_h...-f109r.htm
http://warfare.uphero.com/Medieval/Liber_ad_h...-f110r.htm
http://warfare.uphero.com/Medieval/Liber_ad_h...-f112r.htm

Main source page for all of the above:
http://warfare.uphero.com/Medieval/Liber_ad_honorem_Augusti.htm
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