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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 9:18 am    Post subject: Looking for saber reproduction, need opinions.         Reply with quote

So, I'm in the market for a new sword and this time I'd like a decent, relatively inexpensive saber.

I'm currently looking at Stromlo Swords, who sells products made by Indian producer Weaponedge, but finding reviews have proven to be rather difficult. Basically, I'm wondering if anyone here own or have owned a sword from Weaponedge and what the opinions on them are. Primarily, I want to know if they handle well, can be said to be durable enough for practical use, and have accurate distal tapers.

The other company I'm looking at is Military Heritage, and I also consider some Windlass sabers. Just as with Weaponedge, I'm interested in opinions on their quality, handling and design.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.


Last edited by Anders Backlund on Thu 30 Jul, 2009 9:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Elling Polden




Location: Bergen, Norway
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PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 9:26 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've got a Military herritage Hadik sabre. It looks great, but is a bit to heavy/unbalanced for fighting.

I have however seen these guys sabres on some markets this summer, and they are quite nice, light, and well handling.
http://www.swords.pl/index.php5?page=Product&...mp;lang=en
they have several other designs besides the Polish hussar. I would sugest mailing them and asking what they have in stock.

"this [fight] looks curious, almost like a game. See, they are looking around them before they fall, to find a dry spot to fall on, or they are falling on their shields. Can you see blood on their cloths and weapons? No. This must be trickery."
-Reidar Sendeman, from King Sverre's Saga, 1201
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 9:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Elling Polden wrote:
I've got a Military herritage Hadik sabre. It looks great, but is a bit to heavy/unbalanced for fighting.


That would be a major concern for me. My taste lie towards finesse-type swashbuckling weapons so I'd want something light and agile with a lot of point control.

Quote:
I have however seen these guys sabres on some markets this summer, and they are quite nice, light, and well handling.
http://www.swords.pl/index.php5?page=Product&...mp;lang=en
they have several other designs besides the Polish hussar. I would sugest mailing them and asking what they have in stock.


The models I'm considering are: French Navy Sword for Stromlo, French Infantry Officer Saber for Military Heritage or one of the American sabers for Windlass. There are some others that aren't too bad but those are the ones that interest me.

Right now I'm mostly after the general opinions so I have an idea of what to expect.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 10:08 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I am not personally familiar with any of the MH or Weapon Edge/Stromlo products, but visually none of them get it quite right--at least when it comes to British swords. And as an antique collector who sees these aged and passed as original, I am happy there are obvious aesthetic differences. I would guess that these visual differences would lead to not quite accurate handling, as well. That is just an assumption, though.

Another option Glen C. likes to mention is http://www.chevalierdauvergne.com/. Again, I am not familiar with their products, but they sure look nice.

Jonathan
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 11:01 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan Hopkins wrote:
I am not personally familiar with any of the MH or Weapon Edge/Stromlo products, but visually none of them get it quite right--at least when it comes to British swords. And as an antique collector who sees these aged and passed as original, I am happy there are obvious aesthetic differences. I would guess that these visual differences would lead to not quite accurate handling, as well. That is just an assumption, though.


I do realize that they're not exact replicas, but in this general price range I expect some compromise. Luckily, historical accuracy isn't that important to me, as long as I still like the look and the sword performs okay.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Glen A Cleeton




Location: Nipmuc USA
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

Posts: 1,831

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 11:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Anders,

As this conversation and interest spans several forums and threads, the information really is already out there. I know folk like to maybe over-scrutinize product with sometimes missing what the interest really relates before a purchase.

More specifically asked; What are your intended uses for acquiring any reproduction of these swords?

While I really do enjoying handling antiques and even some quite seriouss flourishing of them, it has been buying one sabre for myself with the intent of play and cutting that made that decision for me.

What type of curvature are you looking for?
What length are you looking for?
What are your specific intended uses?

Elling's experience with the MH offering shows that even though the distal properties really aren't that bad, others are going to "feel" better. A good amount of intended use is also going to be a matter of anyone getting used to a specific sword, without generalizing that something else may feel a lot nicer. It is somewhat a subjective matter to getting experience with any hand tool or weapon. i make the mistake myself in diversity, simply because I don't spend enough time with a given object. For instance, my 1930s knockoff dollar wristwatch is infinitely more enjoyable in purpose and function than a (now more than decade old) Benrus that has served immortally and eill surely outlive me. It's not a bad watch, just not as nice as some others. I can appreciate the form and use of both in context.

What are you going to be doing with it?????? Idea

BTW, despite denial between Weaponedge, Cold Steel, Windlass, Military Heritage and Stromlo's communictaed insistence; these identical swords are surely being produced in India one way or another and the end resulted products are always going to be a matter of subjective value (depending on use and comparisons to period swords).

I will also (once again) suggest a number of possibilities in the antique and modern military offerings. These period swords, made in the tens of thousands, are quite available and many quite sound enough for "serious" uses of many interests.

Be as specific as you can in your wants and one can better offer advice and suggestions. Be as open to advice and suggestions related to what information you can supply in the equations.

Cheers

GC

Jonathan has way too many Brit ish artillery swords and needs to sell you one

Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 12:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Glen A Cleeton wrote:
Hi Anders,

As this conversation and interest spans several forums and threads, the information really is already out there. I know folk like to maybe over-scrutinize product with sometimes missing what the interest really relates before a purchase.

More specifically asked; What are your intended uses for acquiring any reproduction of these swords?

While I really do enjoying handling antiques and even some quite seriouss flourishing of them, it has been buying one sabre for myself with the intent of play and cutting that made that decision for me.

What type of curvature are you looking for?


Light to medium; I dislike strongly curved swords. The MH Infantry Officer's Sabre is a good measure of what I consider within tolerable limits.

Quote:
What length are you looking for?


Oh, in the 30 inches area, I'd say. (In terms of blade, not the whole sword.) I'm not too picky, though.

Quote:
What are your specific intended uses?


I'd say solo drills, general swinging around, maybe some water bottle cutting if I ever bother sharpening it. Durability is nice but I don't necessarily need a beater. I just want a sword that could be described as a reliable, functional weapon.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Glen A Cleeton




Location: Nipmuc USA
Joined: 21 Aug 2003

Posts: 1,831

PostPosted: Thu 30 Jul, 2009 12:55 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

My size, purpose and value all lead me back to a sword I have learned to like quite a bit. I would say just stay away from the extreme budget price end, which will include those sold through such as Deepeeka. If there is a $79usd vs $129usd sword of similar stature on the same site, there is a real reason for the maxim of getting what one pays for. Going by what I having been reading of offerings, Stromlo my be your best source for a newly produced sharp . If shopping Ebay or a similar venue, try to price match (or better) known examples. For instance buying a Windlass or Cold Steel branded item. I mention Stromlo because of his offering sharps from Weapon Edge at the same blunt price and worldwide shipping. The only downside I see there is waiting for production of a given item. There are other European and British sources for the same lines from India. These have been posted in the past elsewhere by me. Again, the biggest consideration for source might be delivered sharps.

What I really hate to do to anyone is convince someone my choices are going to please the person buying one. It is a bit like choosing a vehicle for someone else that then finds dissapointment one way or another.

For good sound period swords that are already sharp (or quite sharpenable), look to local militaria sites, auctions and shows, There is a vast market of fairly low cost and minty swords that might suit your tastes and the late 19th century to early 20th century is the period I would suggest for period users. Don't spend a fortune on these because they are often offered at inflated prices for what is everyday common at cheap.

Good luck with it, either way.

GC
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 12:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I know man who forgin very well sabres. I make sabres for my but this man is specialist for sabres europien and asian. I bought one and not regret :-) Historical accuracy, balance and flexibility for practice and fencing.
My kozak sabre cost 115 euro without scabbart, blade lenht 80 cm weight 750 gram.
He is from Czech but he have not web site only mail.
I can send this mail and I think that he speak english.

There is only one art of fence yet many ways to reach it
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 1:24 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Pic my sabre from Jindrich Figura (his photo) and picture sabre for my friend from this artisan.


 Attachment: 70.15 KB
9kilic 15stol.JPG


 Attachment: 141.78 KB
[ Download ]

There is only one art of fence yet many ways to reach it
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

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PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 2:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

This is my kozak sabre. I muddle before pictures.


 Attachment: 54.49 KB
kozáci pochva.JPG


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Elling Polden




Location: Bergen, Norway
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PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 3:22 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Concerning the MH Hadik, my statement that it is to heavy refers to free play fencing. I am used to medevial swords with the balance at 10-5 cm in front of the cross, so the extreme front balance of sabres is quite unfamiliar to me, and makes light, controlled blows dificult.
For solo drills and cutting, however, it would do just fine.

"this [fight] looks curious, almost like a game. See, they are looking around them before they fall, to find a dry spot to fall on, or they are falling on their shields. Can you see blood on their cloths and weapons? No. This must be trickery."
-Reidar Sendeman, from King Sverre's Saga, 1201
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 6:54 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Vaclav, those aren't too bad, but I'm not really looking for alternative makers at this point; rather opinions on the ones I'm already considering. Still, thanks for the contribution.

Elling Polden wrote:
Concerning the MH Hadik, my statement that it is to heavy refers to free play fencing. I am used to medevial swords with the balance at 10-5 cm in front of the cross, so the extreme front balance of sabres is quite unfamiliar to me, and makes light, controlled blows dificult.
For solo drills and cutting, however, it would do just fine.


To me that's a bit of a contradiction, I'm afraid. I'm specifically looking for something that isn't too front heavy and does allow light, controlled movements. The intended use isn't really a factor in that.

This is important to me, because I know from experience that if I dislike how a sword handles, I'll simply never use it.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 7:29 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Anders,
I am not sure that you will find a replica sword that will be ideal, but probably one that is just good enough. Of the swords you mentioned the French sword looks quite nice. I would also suggest that certain antiques might work well for your purposes. Two swords models that fall within the same price range are the Spanish M1907 "Puerto Seguro" trooper's sword and the late 19th century Italian cavalry trooper's swords (M1888 or something like that). Both types can be found for $200-$300 and will probably live up to your expectations more than the Weapon Edge or Windlass offerings. These swords are pretty common. If you are interested I can send you links to some for sale on dealer sites or eBay.

Good luck with your search!

Jonathan
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 8:04 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

There is problem with mass production wearpons. For this purpose it better flat and heavy weight.
You need custom maker for profiling cross section of blade or original sabre.
Man that I describe make light on front like original and excelent heat treat beyond you can buy original in good condition.

There is only one art of fence yet many ways to reach it
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Luke Zechman




Location: Lock Haven Pennsylvania
Joined: 18 Jan 2009

Posts: 278

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 8:50 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan,
I would be interested in looking at some antique sabers if you could supply me with the online sellers names. I am looking at the 200 to 300 dollar range.
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 8:57 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jonathan Hopkins wrote:
Anders,
I am not sure that you will find a replica sword that will be ideal, but probably one that is just good enough.


That was the plan. Good enough is good enough for me.

Quote:
Of the swords you mentioned the French sword looks quite nice.


Which one? The Stromlo one or the Military Heritage one?

The Navy Sword from Stromlo/Weaponedge is the strongest contender right now, but I still don't know the measurements since they're not listed. The dimensions of other repros of this type of sword seems to vary by quite a bit, and I'm hoping it's not too short for my taste.

Quote:
I would also suggest that certain antiques might work well for your purposes. Two swords models that fall within the same price range are the Spanish M1907 "Puerto Seguro" trooper's sword and the late 19th century Italian cavalry trooper's swords (M1888 or something like that). Both types can be found for $200-$300 and will probably live up to your expectations more than the Weapon Edge or Windlass offerings. These swords are pretty common. If you are interested I can send you links to some for sale on dealer sites or eBay.


I do like the Puerto Seguro - I'm not a big fan of those late narrow thrusting sabers but I make the M1907 an exception because I think it has kind of a nice, classic Zorro-type look.

That said, I prefer more, well, "saber-looking" sabers. Still, I guess it can't hurt to look.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Jonathan Hopkins




PostPosted: Fri 31 Jul, 2009 9:25 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Here is a link to a fairly recent discussion at SFI concerning the Italian and Spanish sword patterns (btw, the Italian sword is an M1873):

http://www.swordforum.com/forums/showthread.p...light=1907

I will send PMs regarding listings for these swords, although it may be later this weekend rather than tonight.

Jonathan
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Anders Backlund




Location: Sweden
Joined: 24 Oct 2007

Posts: 629

PostPosted: Fri 11 Sep, 2009 2:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Update: Well, it seems like I'll be getting an antique saber after all - a Dutch 1852 infantry sword.

To me honest, I'm not completely comfortable with the idea of owning an antique weapon, but this model does seem to match my preferences more or less exactly and since the cost comes to about the same I'd have to pay for a reproduction anyway, I don't think I can complain.

The sword is an ode to the strife of mankind.

"This doesn't look easy... but I bet it is!"
-Homer Simpson.
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Luka Borscak




Location: Croatia
Joined: 11 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Fri 11 Sep, 2009 3:26 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Do you plan to cut with it?
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