Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Steel bows? Reply to topic
This is a standard topic  
Author Message
Ben P.




Location: Mountainous Terrain
Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Reading list: 1 book

Posts: 200

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 9:02 am    Post subject: Steel bows?         Reply with quote

I came across a website that stated that the Guptas used steel longbows is this true? and if so
how effective were these bows?
View user's profile Send private message
Dan Howard




Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
Joined: 08 Dec 2004

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 3,493

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 1:42 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Steel bows have been used historically. They aren't as efficient as composite bows or even self bows but they can be stored for decades in arsenals since they require little maintancnce.
View user's profile Send private message
Ben P.




Location: Mountainous Terrain
Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Reading list: 1 book

Posts: 200

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 1:48 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Dan Howard wrote:
Steel bows have been used historically. They aren't as efficient as composite bows or even self bows but they can be stored for decades in arsenals since they require little maintancnce.


So what is the draw weight how powerful are they? could you give me some links?
View user's profile Send private message
Dan Howard




Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
Joined: 08 Dec 2004

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 3,493

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 2:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

We recently discussed this on another forum. The energy stored in steel at maximum deformation is 130 J/kg. Compare this to yew 900, horn 1500, and tendon 2500. However, steel is more compact because of its density. An equal volume of steel would store 2080 J to yew's 900. But the steel would weigh 16kg compared to yew, which would only weigh 1kg. Looking at this, steel seems to be a poor material for bows. This might change as the weapon increases in size. Steel would be better for heavy crossbows and seige weapons because the volume of wood would be too great to make anything practical from it.
View user's profile Send private message
Ben P.




Location: Mountainous Terrain
Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Reading list: 1 book

Posts: 200

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 2:22 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Dan Howard wrote:
We recently discussed this on another forum. The energy stored in steel at maximum deformation is 130 J/kg. Compare this to yew 900, horn 1500, and tendon 2500. However, steel is more compact because of its density. An equal volume of steel would store 2080 J to yew's 900. But the steel would weigh 16kg compared to yew, which would only weigh 1kg. Looking at this, steel seems to be a poor material for bows. This might change as the weapon increases in size. Steel would be better for heavy crossbows and seige weapons because the volume of wood would be too great to make anything practical from it.


Thank you for your information, sir. Happy
View user's profile Send private message
Gary Teuscher





Joined: 19 Nov 2008

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 3:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Quote:
The energy stored in steel at maximum deformation is 130 J/kg. Compare this to yew 900, horn 1500, and tendon 2500. However, steel is more compact because of its density. An equal volume of steel would store 2080 J to yew's 900. But the steel would weigh 16kg compared to yew, which would only weigh 1kg. Looking at this, steel seems to be a poor material for bows. This might change as the weapon increases in size. Steel would be better for heavy crossbows and seige weapons because the volume of wood would be too great to make anything practical from it.


Interesting stuff, Dan. What site was this discussion on?
View user's profile Send private message
Dan Howard




Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
Joined: 08 Dec 2004

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 3,493

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 3:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Gary Teuscher wrote:
Quote:
The energy stored in steel at maximum deformation is 130 J/kg. Compare this to yew 900, horn 1500, and tendon 2500. However, steel is more compact because of its density. An equal volume of steel would store 2080 J to yew's 900. But the steel would weigh 16kg compared to yew, which would only weigh 1kg. Looking at this, steel seems to be a poor material for bows. This might change as the weapon increases in size. Steel would be better for heavy crossbows and seige weapons because the volume of wood would be too great to make anything practical from it.


Interesting stuff, Dan. What site was this discussion on?


http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=49776
View user's profile Send private message
Gary Teuscher





Joined: 19 Nov 2008

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Tue 13 Jan, 2009 4:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I must say again, pretty interesting. Especially the treatise on bow physics.

I've done some calculations based on similar things, but the speed of the limb movement is something I've had ideas about, but nothing concrete. Seems like this goes more into that limb movement thing, though I only perused it briefly and I'm not sure if it addresses the terminal velocity issue.
View user's profile Send private message
Leo Todeschini
Industry Professional



Location: Oxford, UK
Joined: 12 Nov 2006
Likes: 1 page

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 1,633

PostPosted: Wed 14 Jan, 2009 12:55 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

The Wallace Collection has a couple of Indian or Persian steel bows, I forget which and what is interesting is that they are flat on the back and triangular on the belly. No idea as to stats though.

In the 1950's in the UK and maybe elsewhere you could buy some tubular steel and beatifully if cheaply made bows that break down in the middle and plug together. A friend of mine has one and it shoots very nicely and quickly and is about 30lb. They were apparently prone to internal corrosion with no visible external corrosion and should be shot with extreme care now.

I also think from Robert Hardy's book, the last English enemy shot with a bow was in the Second world war and was shot with a steel bow as the wooden one had been broken.

Tod

www.todsworkshop.com
www.todcutler.com
www.instagram.com/todsworkshop
www.facebook.com/TodTodeschini
www.youtube.com/user/todsstuff1
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Michael Curl




Location: Northern California, US
Joined: 06 Jan 2008

Posts: 487

PostPosted: Wed 14 Jan, 2009 4:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hey Dan, I was looking at that website you linked to, how realistic an RPG is it? I mean compared to Dungeons and dragons?
E Pluribus Unum
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Dan Howard




Location: Maitland, NSW, Australia
Joined: 08 Dec 2004

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 3,493

PostPosted: Wed 14 Jan, 2009 10:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I've probably played close to 50 different RPG systems over the last 25 years and IMO GURPS is the most realistic and versatile. It has been my favourite for a long time.
View user's profile Send private message
Gary Teuscher





Joined: 19 Nov 2008

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Thu 15 Jan, 2009 9:32 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Ever looked at TROS or Harnmaster?

TROS as a game is a great combat simulator, endorsed by ARMA. LIttle too much fluff in their "toughness issues" and things like that but otherwise a great simulator.

IMO, Harmaster is the most realistc system out there, but takes some tweaking to get to be as realisic as I like it.

You ought to like something about Harnmaster though. Depending on which version of the rules you use and which optional ones, Mail and Plate are almost never penetrated by melee weapons or bows - but the wearer can get pretty bruised up inside Big Grin

No Conan types cutting through metal helmet and coif all the time!
View user's profile Send private message
M. Eversberg II




Location: California, Maryland, USA
Joined: 07 Sep 2006
Reading list: 3 books

Spotlight topics: 1
Posts: 1,435

PostPosted: Thu 15 Jan, 2009 3:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Dan, when I finish my setting, I might have to send it to you for a look through. It's based around DnD, but using the E6 rules, with a lot of melee combat stuff rewritten by me to try and more accurately portray interesting combat.

M.

This space for rent or lease.
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger ICQ Number
Lafayette C Curtis




Location: Indonesia
Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Reading list: 7 books

Posts: 2,689

PostPosted: Sun 18 Jan, 2009 8:40 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Indian steel bows? Just check the article on the new Sagittarius site (it's also on the old site but the navigation there is a bit less intuitive) :

http://www.sagittarius.utwente.nl/index.php?o...;Itemid=38
View user's profile Send private message


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Steel bows?
Page 1 of 1 Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2020 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum